May 09 2012

How Would You Have Done The Avengers Differently?

Published by at 11:09 am under Comic Book Movies

Is there anything about The Avengers you would have done differently? If so, what? (I wouldn’t recommend reading the comments here until you’ve seen the movie–there will probably be many spoilers).

21 responses so far

21 Responses to “How Would You Have Done The Avengers Differently?”

  1. B. McKenzieon 09 May 2012 at 11:35 am

    –I would have cut Coulson’s death, had Hawkeye die instead, and removed Maria Hill altogether. This would mainly have served to free up a bit of space later on and remove the two most redundant characters* while sparing a character who had interesting relationships going on.

    *In the actual movie, pretty much everything Hawkeye says or does after breaking the mind-control could be handed off to Black Widow and/or Captain America. I don’t think Maria Hill contributed anything beyond what Nick Fury already brought to the picture.

    –I would have gone with a terrestrial threat, probably something closer to HYDRA/Red Skull or a particularly ambitious human supervillain rather than Loki and the alien invasion. Loki was okay, but I think this would give more opportunities for stronger characterization and some moral complexity.

    –It probably would have helped to give the supervillain at least one disastrous-but-attainable goal. The movie-makers obviously won’t let the villain take over the world or conquer humanity. I don’t think there’s much drama or suspense there. I felt a lot more suspense from Loki trying to kill the elderly fellow in Stuttgart because it looked like Loki might succeed. One intermediate goal that comes to mind would be trying to assassinate a hero. Nick Fury comes to mind because he’s likable, his actor is 63 years old*, and Fury has a second-in-command–if viewers think it’s plausible that the movie-makers might want to kill Fury, his fate will be more intriguing.

    *Hollywood has made plot decisions based on less.

    –Another possibility for suspense would have been giving a protagonist a major goal unlikely to succeed. For example, if Black Widow is trying to assassinate the villain out of revenge whereas, say, Captain America demands that the villain be taken alive, at most one of them could succeed.

  2. thepopeofbeerson 09 May 2012 at 1:37 pm

    More shirtless scenes. Preferably male.

  3. B. Macon 09 May 2012 at 2:19 pm

    100% of the shirtlessness in the movie was male. And green.



    I like that they didn’t do much in the way of pandering. (Well, Black Widow’s outfit was impractically tight, but that’s pretty minor compared to Halle Berry’s Catwoman, Jessica Alba’s Invisible Woman, and everybody in Batman & Robin). It helped me take the characters more seriously. Additionally, most of the movies which pandered aggressively (e.g. Catwoman, Batman & Robin and probably Elektra) fared extremely poorly in terms of reviews.



    I suppose taking away Hawkeye’s mask helped increase his romantic appeal.

  4. Milanon 09 May 2012 at 7:04 pm

    – I would change Stan Lee’s cameo joke from an utterly immersion-breaking genre savvy negative comment to something that made him an in-story character and built on the vibe of the conclusion instead of killing it.

    That’s about it! I loved the rest of it. Coulson’s exit makes room for my own character (in my head), but mine has some way to go in terms of industry acceptance so meanwhile I’d keep Coulson alive (might need to make him immortal for that). Or Coulson Zombie for Avengers 2!

    I liked the simplicity of Good vs Evil, it made it possible to exhibit a lot of characters instead. Creating future team conflicts might require “Good” to become more complicated. Maria Hill did help to make Nick Fury part of an organization rather than “a guy riding his helicarrier”.

  5. Carl Shinyamaon 09 May 2012 at 10:06 pm

    Hmmm… Not much that I would have changed, except slight things:

    I would have had Loki take on most, if not the entire Avengers team simultaneously in combat to make him appear more competent.

  6. B. McKenzieon 09 May 2012 at 10:13 pm

    I think that’s a good catch, Carl. ONE of the Avengers ripped him a new one and it wasn’t even close.

  7. Carl Shinyamaon 10 May 2012 at 11:01 am

    Yeah, but I’m not complaining too much because it led to one of my favorite lines: “Puny god.”

  8. Sylaron 10 May 2012 at 3:27 pm

    I would have done Stan Lee’s cameo differently. I would have had him walking down the street, oblivious to the chaos around him, reading Avengers #1. Then, he’d look up, see the carnage, and throw the comic away, saying to himself, “I gotta stop reading those.”

  9. Indigoon 12 May 2012 at 1:48 am

    @Carl
    That was easily my favorite part of the movie! Something about Loki thinking he could get in a whole monologue in front of the HULK and not even getting to finish his sentence was hilarious!

    I would have liked to have seen Ant Man and the Wasp, and possibly the Vision. Perhaps in the sequel…

    I second the complaint about Stan Lee’s cameo-his cameos are usually a little more funny and/or clever than what he said. I mean, really? It was so ironic that it wasn’t funny at all. And I like Stan Lee, so that’s saying a lot.

    I also wouldn’t have killed Agent Coulson-he was just so likeable and I liked the fact that he didn’t even need powers to be competent.

  10. Castilleon 12 May 2012 at 10:03 am

    @B-Mac-

    I think there was a very clear reason why they didn’t kill off Hawkeye. I believe that the studio may be trying to use the Avengers movie as a platform to give Black Widow and Hawkeye their own solo movies. In addition, the actor playing Hawkeye is considered an A-lister in Hollywood right now, so they want to continue to utilize his ‘star-power’.

    Also, I believe that Coulson might not be dead yet. As regards to Maria Hill, I believe they are saving her for future Avengers movies or for that ‘S.H.I.E.L.D.’ film you know is going to happen eventually.

    As to Loki getting beaten by one of the Avengers I’d say that was rather fair. He was able to hold his own against Captain America, and would’ve probably also beaten Hawkeye and Black Widow in a fight. He also fought Thor to a draw so I would say he wasn’t completely useless in a fight.

    It was just that the only avengers that might have posed a direct threat to him were Iron Man and the Hulk.

  11. crescon 13 May 2012 at 4:38 pm

    I would have had less Paltrow in it, she wasn’t even playing the same character really. Not a real gripe, but she takes me out of every movie she’s in.

    I would have had The Hulk talk a little more, casual movie goers don’t even realize he can.

    I thought the end fight was amazing, but a little disjointed. Cap kept showing up to save Widow when he was in a completely different place earlier. One minute Thor is up on a building the next he is standing next to Cap.

    I actually loved the Loki beatdown. If Loki was so formidable why would he need such a large, well armed, alien force? They’d already established that Hulk was physically stronger than Thor. I liked that beating the villian was as easy as putting your strongest guy in right place at the right time.

  12. B. McKenzieon 14 May 2012 at 1:21 am

    “I would have had less Paltrow in it, she wasn’t even playing the same character really.” That’s a good point. If I had to have a bit role for Potts/Paltrow vs. a bit role for Jane Foster/Natalie Portman, I’d probably have chosen Portman, if possible–Portman probably wasn’t available or was deemed too expensive for the movie, given that she didn’t show up on camera even once. Potts/Paltrow just feels a bit less believable for the role. (Out of all of the hundreds of super-desirable women Tony Stark has wooed, why would Potts/Paltrow be romantically special to him? It doesn’t feel believable he’d go after Potts/Paltrow rather than, say, Black Widow, who strikes me as more exciting, sexy and intelligent*).

    *Although, as a rule, I try not to date people named “Black Widow.”



    “I actually loved the Loki beatdown. If Loki was so formidable why would he need such a large, well armed, alien force?” First, if Loki couldn’t even take on the Hulk, why would the Chitauri count on him rather than someone tough enough to get the job done? If they were counting on him, perhaps they could have given him some assistance (e.g. better armor) to make him more threatening? Second, was the alien force really that intimidating? The alien invasions in other superhero movies have been a lot more threatening and the superheroes have been more indispensable. If the protagonists were removed from the Green Lantern or Fantastic Four movies, the antagonists would certainly have succeeded. In contrast, Iron Man could destroy at least one of the giant turtle things alone, so that suggests to me that the USAF could also… I suspect the U.S. military have probably handled this with or without nuclear weapons (albeit more slowly and with more casualties*).

    *As depicted in the Avengers, I’d estimate somewhere between 50,000 – 200,000 civilians died on-screen (I think four skyscrapers were destroyed before many people would have had time to evacuate).

  13. crescon 19 May 2012 at 12:23 pm

    “First, if Loki couldn’t even take on the Hulk, why would the Chitauri count on him rather than someone tough enough to get the job done?”

    Because they, as do a lot of people in the Marvel Universe, underestimatedthe Hulk. I’ll admit that I’ve been waiting a long time for my ‘Hulk’ moment, for someone to turn to the Jolly Green Giant and say ‘Hulk Smash!’ They litereally did that and it was wonderful for the child in me.

    And yeah, the Aliens weren’t really that formidable. Better than Eric Bana’s lame Romulan villian though.

  14. Gogopowon 21 May 2012 at 6:10 pm

    I would rather have had a superhero die than Coulson. Hawkeye is a good choice. (Thank goodness they didn’t use his comic costume.) Coulson seemed to represent the “normal” people. I think he gave the movies a more human touch. Yeah his death did add to the movie. But that leaves me wondering who and what will take the human role in other movies. I just hate to lose him because he was not a “in-your-face” cocky guy, not a body building, not whimpy. Just an all American hard working quiet guy who tries to do what is right. Plus he wasn’t corrupted (is that the right word?) by SHIELD where they do anything of their own interests, hurt people or not. I get the feeling that shield is a very gray company. Not good, not bad, just in the middle.

    I would also rework the evil villains more. I didn’t mind Loki. I could tell he was a spoiled ignorant brat, but he was also clever in trying to rip apart the team. I just like the break from super bad evil villains. I liked how he was trying to wear the “big boy pants” in ruling the world when it didn’t fit him. I didn’t understand the alien invasions. I haven’t read the comics, so I don’t know too much about the guy shown in the end. But I think it would have been better if they showed that Loki was just a game piece in the whole matter. He seems like a character that would get used and then tossed to the side. Yet in the movie it was like “Oh? Humans apparently can fight.”
    For one thing, why trust Loki to do the dirty work. I think they could have shown that better.

  15. Jaredon 21 May 2012 at 6:41 pm

    I know this may seem kind of heartless, but I REALLY would have preferred it if Iron Man had been lost deep in the universe, when he flew through the portal in the last thirty minutes.

    Think about it.

    It would have done THREE very important things for the movie.

    1) For one, it would have offered excellent SEQUEL fodder. The Avengers now REALLY have something to avenge.

    2)Adds a bittersweet taste. They really could have worked in themes of loss, and redemption, along with sacrifice.

    3)Finally, Iron Man himself has kind of held the team together with his general personality throughout the entire film. What happens without him? Do they fall apart? Or does the IDEA of Tony Stark keep them together?

  16. B. McKenzieon 21 May 2012 at 6:50 pm

    “But that leaves me wondering who and what will take the human role in other movies.” Ah, that’s a good question. Peter Parker strikes me as the most promising possibility (although I would have felt more confident with Tobey Maguire for this than Andrew Garfield). If the rebooted Spider-Man is not sufficiently likable, Captain America strikes me as the least bad alternative.



    “Thank goodness they didn’t use his comic costume.” Marvel’s costume/makeup/CGI guys have generally* done a really good job visually adapting comic book characters for the movies–for example, the adjustments to the X-Men uniforms and Hawkeye made it a bit easier to take the characters seriously, I think. In contrast, I’m still sort of shellshocked by Green Lantern’s version of Hector Hammond.

    *Most notable exceptions: The Thing, First Class’s Beast, and maybe Loki. Pretty minor in the grand scheme of things.

  17. Sar Bearon 21 May 2012 at 7:25 pm

    @B. McKenzie

    I read that Natalie Portman really wanted to be in the movie, but while they were filming, she was very, very pregnant and they decided it wouldn’t work.

  18. B. McKenzieon 21 May 2012 at 7:26 pm

    “I know this may seem kind of heartless, but I REALLY would have preferred it if Iron Man had been lost deep in the universe, when he flew through the portal in the last thirty minutes.” This strikes me as promising, although for the sake of the Iron Man franchise, they’d probably have him find his way back in the next Iron Man movie.

  19. B. McKenzieon 21 May 2012 at 7:31 pm

    “I read that Natalie Portman really wanted to be in the movie, but while they were filming, she was very, very pregnant and they decided it wouldn’t work.” Ah, that makes sense. She had been confirmed to be in the film, so I was wondering why they decided not to use her.

  20. Castilleon 21 May 2012 at 9:39 pm

    It’s all about money for the studios unfortunately and that is what sells their decisions. I think that Hawkeye represented a chance for some kind of spin-off as does the Black Widow. They definitely want to get as many super-hero movies out there as possible given the high exposure this movie got.

    Also I’m already wondering who could be in an avengers 2. I’m thinking maybe Hawkeye sits the next one out and they just focus on his film. Hank Pym would be a good choice to be added to the team as well as Maybe Dr. Strange. The X-men and the mutants will never be there so long as Fox owns the rights. Ditto for spider-man because I don’t think that the film rights for that one would be given up considering Spiderman is the most recognizable Marvel superhero out there.

    I thought Thor might have been a bit overpowered in this film compared to when he was in his feature film. In this one, he’s shown to withstand a punch from the Hulk and push it back. Whereas in his feature film, he has difficulty with a fight from a normal human. The hammer gave him too much power I think, what with the lightening ability and the flying…

    For a while there I was afraid that the melee fighters (Black Widow/Captain America) wouldn’t have that much to do…. But I was wrong I guess.

  21. Mr. Crowleyon 28 May 2012 at 2:25 pm

    This is what my plot would have been.
    -I would have ditched the scepter. Loki is the god of lies, why does he need something to do what he should be able to?
    -I wouldn’t of had Loki go in guns blazing. I would have had him claim that he simply wants to go home, I don’t remember anyone meeting him outside of that town so after a while of manipulation, he could get SHIELD on his side.
    -He also convinces them that Thor has gone crazy with grief, Odin has died (lie), and the loss of his brother and with no way to earth he is a little unhinged.
    -Tell them that he only wants to get back, and that the tesseract could allow him to do that.
    -Hydra remnants steal tesseract after a large fight where Loki tries to stop them from taking it.
    -SHIELD calls the avengers together to attempt to stop Hydra.
    -More character development, less fight scenes as the team comes together and slowly Loki gains their trust, while also laying doubts of other members intents.
    -The argument scene, Loki comes out as only level headed member.
    -Thor finds a way to earth and ends up in the Hydra facility.
    -After being shown that Hydra is fighting Loki, he joins their side.
    -SHIELD tracks down the tesseract and the Avengers fight off Thor while SHIELD deals with HYDRA.
    -Thor is captured but attempts to tell the Avengers that Loki cant be trusted, but they ignore him.
    -Loki convinces Thor that he really only wants to return to Asgard to face punishment.
    -They figure out how to use the tesseract with the arc reactor.
    -Loki uses tesseract to summon his army.
    -Nick Fury is the only one to get there in time, Loki critically injures him.
    -Captain America and Iron Man arrive. argument where Loki reveals true colors, he is going to use to earth as a springboard to conquering Asgard, as they would never let him become ruler again unless he conquered it.
    -Iron Man forced to fly Nick Fury to safety while Captain America fights Loki, hoping to stall him until SHIELD arrives.
    -Loki removes the Helicarrier from the playing field by blowing it out of the sky.
    -Bruce survives the explosion by Hulking out.
    -Thor escapes and flies toward Stark tower.
    -Captain America is pinned down and Thor arrives as Loki’s personal guard arrives and nearly destroys them. Thor gets Steve to safety at the Hydra bunker, where surviving members of SHIELD who were on the ground have holed up.
    -Warehouse scene with Bruce.
    -Captain America comes up with a rousing speech, then lays down a quick battle plan.
    -Scene on the bridge with the space whale and Bruce.
    -Battle scenes that show the casualties of the fight.
    -Battle scenes that show SHIELD doing something.
    -Battle scenes that show that SHIELD, even though they are doing their best and have a god, a tactician, and a man with high tech armor, and the Hulk, are outnumbered and are at best only holding off the inevitable.
    -Scene where Loki reveals that even though he is getting what he wanted, he actually does feel guilt for betraying them all. But resigns himself to a fate of betraying and lies.
    -Council scene where they reveal the nuke.
    -Nick Fury goes out heavily injured and with a bazooka to shoot down the plane, but there are two.
    -Nick Fury calls Iron Man to warn him of the Nuke.
    -Scene where Tony flies up into the portal with Nuke and destroys the mother ship.
    -Army goes into shock from loss of mother ship.
    -SHIELD kills all the ones left alive and defenseless.
    -Thor beats the ever loving crap out of Loki.
    -Thor drags Loki outside the building and to the gathered Avengers, where they wont even talk to him, sending Loki even further into self loathing, he wants them to hate him, but they wont even give him that.
    -World is saved, but there is a giant hole in the sky over new york, a secret ops organization is revealed, and half the people in new york are injured or dead.
    -Bittersweet shot as everyone goes different ways.
    -Scene with Thanos

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