Apr 05 2010

Mr. Crowley’s Review Forum

Published by at 4:43 pm under Review Forums

Please see the comments below.  Thanks!

123 responses so far

123 Responses to “Mr. Crowley’s Review Forum”

  1. Mr. Crowleyon 12 Apr 2010 at 5:04 pm

    All Ive got right now is a general prose, its a world full of mentally flawed and disturbed superheroes. theres an irradiated man thats afraid of touching anything because he’ll turn it radioactive or give it radiation poisoning. another hero addicted to his power suit so much he doesnt care that its slowely killing him with skin cancer. I came up with the idea when out of nowhere the phrase “when gods fall” came to my head, I started thinking about how superheroes are seen as gods to the people in there universes. If anyone can come up with anything to add or help me with the storyline that would be awsome.

  2. Beccaon 12 Apr 2010 at 6:48 pm

    I like the ideas of the two characters you’ve mentioned so far. What are they like, personality-wise? What are their pasts like, and what are the challenges they’re facing in the present?

  3. thepopeofbeerson 12 Apr 2010 at 10:24 pm

    It’s helpful to figure out what your main characters want. Your radioactive man may want a cure for his condition, or your hero who’s addicted to his power suit may start seeking out increasingly dangerous situations so he has a *reason* to wear his power suit.

  4. Mr. Crowleyon 13 Apr 2010 at 2:14 pm

    Well, those are just the two characters, I’ve come up with so far. There’s going to be an entire cast of heroes.

    The Radioactive Man (changing name later) was a nuclear physicist that exposed himself to radiation. This turned his skin almost see-through and gave him an atomic touch. He tries to find a way to remove his powers, but eventually he realizes that his powers will never go away and becomes a radioactive power source. In terms of personality he’s a quiet man and schizophrenic, never able to keep a train of thought after being blasted by radiation in the accident.

    Power-suited Man (changing name later) found an alien ship and took some technology to build a power suit. He becomes addicted to the power of his suit until he learns he has skin cancer. He tries to stop but a part of him wants to continue. These feelings eventually cause his personality to split; the half that wants to continue becomes the main villain and starts a crime spree so he’ll have to continue using the suit. He’s a serious character and an eternal pessimist.

    Martian (changing name later) came to Earth from Mercury and tried to learn about humanity with his telepathy. He also used his telepathy to disguise his appearance. Eventually, he opens his mind to the entire world and becomes a bit like Legion from X-men. He has multiple personalities and they interchange with the dominant one at random times. He is a partial nihilist because of his long time on Mercury alone and is constantly trying to accumulate information.

    I’m going to add more characters later. Any suggestions on these would be great.

  5. Ragged Boyon 13 Apr 2010 at 3:45 pm

    Hello, Mr. Crowley
    Here are my concerns and ideas about your last comment:

    – Your characters are… okay. I’m worried that these characters feel a little too negative. You’ve got a schizophrenic, a half psycho, and an unrelatable sentient alien. If any of these characters are main characters I’d recommend giving them a few more likeable or relatable traits. As of now they seem a little negative-heavy and underdeveloped. I’d this article or this one.

    – Along with the previous point, I also think your origin stories are a little negative-heavy as well. It makes these characters a little hard to relate to and makes the story seem very grim. Unless, that’s what you intended.

    – As a whole, I don’t feel that these characters are entirely fresh. However, depending on the size of your cast I don’t think this is that much of a problem. I do sorta think Power-suited Man is kinda interesting. I like the idea of him starting trouble to give himself purpose.

    – On a different note, Your mechanical writing could use some work. There were many glaring errors in spelling, punctuation, grammar, and capitalization. Additionally, there were some tense issues and run-on sentences that made editing a little difficult. I’d recommend cleaning up your writing if you plan to get published. Publishers reject 99.9% of submitted novel without getting past the first page, don’t let mechanical errors get your novel flung into the trash heap.

    I apologize if this comment is a little negative. The one I don’t want to do is discourage you. Hopefully, this helps.

  6. Mr. Crowleyon 13 Apr 2010 at 3:54 pm

    Actually id like to thank you. actually I dont type well on the internet but when im writing something seriously I tend to check about 5 times to see if what I wrote is ledgible and makes sense. Im trying to portray a grim story about mentaly disturbed heroes who have very negative traits, I intend to have a few lighter characters but these are the first Ive come up with at the moment.

  7. Pon 13 Apr 2010 at 5:29 pm

    The fact that your characters have mental issues actually makes them more interesting.

    On that note I have a few questions, mostly about Powersuit due to his interesting personality.

    Are you planning one portraying any parts of the story in first person?

    Does Powersuit’s armor originate from Mercury? And if so, is Martian against Powersuit for becoming addicted to it’s use?

    Is one of Powersuit’s personalities guilty for what he does? What is the extent of his split personality?

    Thanks.

  8. Ragged Boyon 13 Apr 2010 at 6:01 pm

    ” I’m trying to portray a grim story about mentally disturbed heroes who have very negative traits. I intend to have a few lighter characters, but these are the first I’ve come up with at the moment.”

    – That’s understandable. Although, I’d note that too much negative could annoy the reader. I’d recommend keeping a lighter character around whenever you have your negative characters.

    Also, I’d recommend reading this article. Just to make sure you don’t give the character a mental disorder instead of a personality.

  9. Mr. Crowleyon 14 Apr 2010 at 1:41 pm

    The suit actually did come to mercury and originaly Cet’k (the alien) does get dissapointed that it was turned into something for war. But Cet’k gains thousands of personalities he barely shows it because his minds constaintly shifting. Harbinger’s (power suited man) split personality is able to control his actions, at one time it programs his suit to fight him when he has to be Azrael (Harbinger’s split personality) it can tap into Harbingers memory and use information about the team(battle plans, secret identities, and mental flaws) against them. The story is told through different points of view through six issues(sorry I forgot to mention its a comic book). Ive made a new character as well.

    Green Streak. after a freak electrical accident, he gained the ability to move at super-sonic speeds. He is Harbingers best friend and helps him with his addiction to his power suit and highly objects to his using when Azrael appears. He dies from a fire the friction from his speed started when he runs on gasoline. He is an optimist and a very friendly person. He has a fear of speed because his dad, a race car driver, died when he was young because he was going to fast and he lost control of his car. Because of this he barely ever goes over 30 MPH.

  10. Mr. Crowleyon 16 Apr 2010 at 2:39 pm

    I just realized I forgot to give the personality of Azrael. He’s a nihilist who thinks that nothing matters, except chaos. He’s determined to destroy anything in his way. He also has no empathy for other people and will kill without flinching.

    There’s also Cronos, a former strongman who gained super strength through a life saving surgeory. He is mute and see’s the rest of the group as his family. Hes also a ticking time bomb. After the surgeory he had about 20 years before he exploded, but stress sped up the process so he only has about 5 years left. He cant swim and dies when Azrael uses this and drowns him. Through his actions we see he cares deeply for living things. He witnessed his father commit murder as a child and his father told him not to tell anyone anything, he proceeded to go mute from the mental strain.

  11. Bronteson 25 May 2010 at 5:48 pm

    I really like the concept for Cronos, also the story as a whole, although it may be because I like this sort of dark thing. You could really work though around Cronos; as you mentioned, Azrael only cares for chaos. Maybe he throws someone who means a lot to him, that person could die because he was afraid? Also, what are Azrael’s powers? I am working on a comic and also have a character named Azrael.

  12. Mr. Crowleyon 05 Aug 2010 at 11:22 am

    Ive been thinking about the concept of the story and I’ve decided to change it to more of a story about heroes faced with there own mortality in the face of an unknown adversary who the press dub Azrael. The world is remarkably a better place because heroes like the metropolitan captured stalin and hitler after pearl harbor, the united states is without debt and has friendly relations with the rest of the world including a soviet union that hasnt collapsed yet. The first to die is the metropolitan (superman expy with survivors guilt over his race). The superhero community is stunned and tries to find the murderer but he is able to kill the Raven (batman expy). Every hero is now facing the fact that an unkown killer can end there life at any time. we learn more about the world from several of the heroes trying to find a link, how the metropolitan made space travel easy with technology from his homeworld, the nineties lead to a darker atmosphere of heroes who killed of most of the earths villains except the shadowman, who was labotomised by the anti-hero known as hitman. He was left catatonic and in a wheel chair. Throughout the story we are given hints towards the identity of the killer, tire tracks from a wheel chair and the like. The heroes keep dropping until the earth is left with none, the last to die is the green streak, the hardest to kill because of his speed, we finally we see that the killer all along was the raven, who pretended to die after he snapped and and started killing heroes to “save” humanity. And that the shadowman was the one who killed the metropolitan.

  13. B. Macon 05 Aug 2010 at 4:27 pm

    So… who’s the main character?

  14. Mr. Crowleyon 05 Aug 2010 at 5:53 pm

    Its told from the perspective of all of the characters who are still living, green streak, harbinger, the bearer, hitman, colonal, and lastly the raven. Who are all characters I came up with when I was around 10 turned into expies of major company characters with some more realistic consequences effecting they’re lifes.

  15. B. Macon 05 Aug 2010 at 7:13 pm

    It might help to give the Raven a goal more threatening than just killing (no-longer-needed) superheroes. I think that would raise the stakes on whether the heroes succeed, which will probably make the plot more interesting.

    Also, it’s hard for me to tell from my end, but there may be too many characters. In particular, you’ll probably need to develop the five living protagonists, the Metropolitan (less so because he dies very quickly), the Raven, and Shadowman. Unless you have something really interesting in store and absolutely need all the characters, I’d recommend thinking about removing 1-2 of the five protagonists, or at least relegating them to bit roles. (IE: early murder victims).

  16. Mr. Crowleyon 06 Aug 2010 at 9:59 am

    Well I was intending to tell the history of they’re world through those characters but I guess I could cut away a few of them. And I was gong to make the world more reliant on the super’s, the people on that earth are in self-imposed idiocy and dont know how to protect themselves from gangs and muggers, because they have relied on the capes for too long.

  17. B. Macon 06 Aug 2010 at 11:23 am

    “the people on that earth are in self-imposed idiocy…” I like that.

    In (I think) Red Son, people stopped using seatbelts or carrying lifeboats on ships because they were 100% confident somebody would swoop in to save them. In real-life, I feel there are some parallels to New Orleans.

  18. Mr. Crowleyon 06 Aug 2010 at 12:18 pm

    I was planing on putting hitman in jail where he’s serving a life sentence after he lobotomized the shadowman, not actually a protagonist, just a person to tell about the nineties, which noone likes to talk about.

    Isnt red son what would happen if superman was a commie?

  19. B. Macon 06 Aug 2010 at 3:31 pm

    “Isnt red son what would happen if superman was a commie?” Yeah.

    So, if Metro dies quickly and Hitman won’t need much character development, I think that’d bring you down to 4 protagonists and 2 antagonists that would need more development. It strikes me as feasible.

  20. Mr. Crowleyon 07 Aug 2010 at 9:58 am

    Hurray for feasability!

    Well Im trying to think of a way to give visual clues to the villain being the shadowman without people going back and wondering why would the raven be in a wheel chair. Can you help me with that?

  21. B. Macon 07 Aug 2010 at 10:35 am

    What are the Shadowman’s powers? What sort of marks/evidence would he leave behind when he fought? Hopefully something that could apply to a few people rather than something too obvious. (I fear that tire-tracks would be too obvious–unless maybe it had rained and the characters weren’t 100% sure that the muddy impressions they were looking at were actually wheel-chair tracks).

    For example, if he has shadow-themed powers, maybe the scene looks sort of charred but the investigators are initially stumped because it doesn’t smell like there was a fire.

    If the Raven were framing the Shadowman, what sort of evidence would he plant? (Tire tracks? Debris from a past Shadowman fight scene? A torn-off part of an old Shadowman uniform, allegedly torn off in the struggle?)

  22. Mr. Crowleyon 07 Aug 2010 at 11:37 am

    The shadowman has the ability to turn himself into a shadow and stop people by stepping on there shadows. He left a calling card before he was lobotomised, his victims would have a shilouette of a man next to them. I like the idea of the debris from a past fight, or perhaps evidence from a court case from when that hero captured him.

  23. Mr. Crowleyon 09 Aug 2010 at 6:35 am

    Im thinking about changing it so that Shadowman is the main villain, just an idea but think for a moment, no one suspects the guy in the wheel chair with a supposedly half shutdown brain.

  24. Mr. Crowleyon 12 Aug 2010 at 7:53 am

    Okay im officially making shadowman the main villain, and im adding a twist ending, Hitman is the last to be killed, and we see shadowmans full body for the first time as he talks to him, hes about to pull the trigger on the gun, when we see his eyes open, hes in a dark room at night in jail, the entire event was a sick dream thought up by him, we slowley fade to black in the hallway as he realizes this and starts laughing, first a slight chuckle, then a laugh, then he starts crying as well as laughing.

  25. B. Macon 12 Aug 2010 at 8:34 am

    So the entire story would be a dream?

  26. Mr. Crowleyon 12 Aug 2010 at 9:33 am

    Somewhat, ive always been a fan of the mind screw technique, I just need help to make it so people dont get pissed, if I cant come up with a way so books dont fly then It wont be a dream, this is all just so I can figure out what I really want to do with the story and its progression, this is simply an idea I like.

  27. Mr. Crowleyon 25 Aug 2010 at 4:00 pm

    I am really liking the idea of this world and I want to do more with the characters than this one story, maybe a multiple series, Id have to tweak a few ideas and change some but I think it could work, Im just going to start with one series that will feature different characters in different issues. If it sells well enough I can start a series for Metropolitan, then the Raven if M sells well, etc.

  28. Ragged Boyon 25 Aug 2010 at 6:18 pm

    The only way I can see it being a dream and it being likeable is if something worthwhile happened. On one end of the scale, you could build up the dream world so that meaningful events that happen in some way affect the outside world*. And on the other end, the dream could motivate him to take some sort of action in the real world.

    *That sounds a lot like Inception. It wasn’t on purpose. But I do love that movie. 😉

  29. Mr. Crowleyon 25 Aug 2010 at 6:29 pm

    I was thinking of something like the second one, he helps the heroes like a hannible lecter, they think hew under theyre thumb then bam, giant event beyond normal human ability happens (im thinking interdimensional beings or the like) that we learn he’s behind. The beings try to screw him over and he proceeds to kill they’re leaders and most of the infantry before they all leave. He is then returned to his cell, after they try to get him in trial but learn they dont have enough evidence to convict him of anything short of his previous conviction of life with no chance of parole. With over 1 million people and 9 heroes killed because of him. He was originally considered a joke among the hero community.

  30. Mr. Crowleyon 26 Aug 2010 at 3:45 pm

    This is the modern history of my world. In 1985 the being known as the Atom destroyed all of history and rebuilt it to the modern one. The metropolitan appeared in 1986 and brought in the new age, with The Raven appearing a month or so later along with the Bearer II and Green Streak II, replacements for the original two heroes. In 2010 the Shadowman has the dream that causes him to start his plans to destroy all heroes.

  31. Mr. Crowleyon 27 Aug 2010 at 1:41 pm

    I just read a wrinkle in time and came up with an idea for Green Streak II, instead of running he “jumps” through space, leaving a color streak as he goes by, and the farther he travels the more speed he builds up upon returning. He cant go through matter though and stops immediately before the object. He suffers the damage a person going at that speed hitting said object, so he cant just appear anywhere, he has to be smart about where he reenters this world. While thinking about the mechanics of this I thought of something he might use so he can get there, a pair of protective goggles that can transmit an image of the city on the lense so he can “jump” to another area, because he has to know a pathway to use his powers. comments?

  32. Ghoston 27 Aug 2010 at 2:47 pm

    Mr. Crowley,
    I just finished reading your posts, and I really like the idea of a Watchmen type story. I like the darker more realistic comics myself (ones like the new x-factor, the ultimate series, supreme power, and of course the Watchmen). However, I don’t think the whole dream thing would work to well. I know that if I read your book, and then found out at the end that the whole story was a dream I would be pissed! Because essentially I just spent 20 to 30 hours (I am kinda a slow reader) having you lie to me by telling me one thing and then doing another.
    On a positive note, I love the concepts for all of your characters. They seem to be well thought out and very deep. I especially like cronos’s back story about the father. Althought, I have to admit that I don’t really understand the whole blowing up thing. I also love the idea of the alien with survivors guilt. I think that character would resonate with me a lot.
    All that being said, I think you should tone down the instability of your characters. Having one character that is batshit crazy is fine, but having a bunch of character’s (especially heroes) that are boarder line batshit crazy may be a little to much. And not just from a readers stand point either. If you as a writer are going sell all of these characters with all off these different mental/ personality disorder to the reader, then you are going to need to do a lot of research to get all of the different nuances just right.
    Now I am not saying that it can’t be done, but it won’t be easy. So you might want to think about using major character flaws instead of actual disorders like they did in the Watchmen. For instance, Nightowl didn’t suffer from major depression (although he was close). Mostly, he just suffered from an inferiority complex which kind of emasculated him. The Comedian wasn’t a true sociopath (although he was pretty close), but rather just an individual you had to supress all of his emotions in order to keep his sanity.

  33. Mr. Crowleyon 28 Aug 2010 at 7:09 pm

    I’m not sure what story I’m telling any more. Originaly it was a watchmen like story, then then less of a watchmen story, and now I’m wondering if I even want to use it as a limited series. I’ve got this whole world of infinite possible stories, and I’m wondering if I should explore these or basically end all chance of further stories with one. Basically I’m stuck between starting at the alpha or the omega.

  34. Ghoston 28 Aug 2010 at 8:34 pm

    Well I think you got a great idea going here. Especially, this one:
    “This is the modern history of my world. In 1985 the being known as the Atom destroyed all of history and rebuilt it to the modern one. The metropolitan appeared in 1986 and brought in the new age, with The Raven appearing a month or so later along with the Bearer II and Green Streak II, replacements for the original two heroes. In 2010 the Shadowman has the dream that causes him to start his plans to destroy all heroes.”
    What you might want to consider doing is making the Shadowman’s plot strech over several books. Start off the first book with the Prophet dying at the beginning to kick things off. Then have the Shadowman play the supers against the villains in order to slowly take each other out over the series. So in the first book the Shadowman can set up the Atom for the death of the Prophet, which causes the supers to hunt down the Atom. All the while the Atom, who is a villian, is attempting to go into the past to discover the true identity of the Shadowman.
    Why?
    Because the Atom has learned about the Shadowman’s plot to rid the world of all metahumans. Knowing that the supers would never believe a villain without any substantial proof, the Atom has decided to take matters into his own hands. However, the Atom is not being truely altruistic, he is simply trying to save his own skin since he knows the Shadowman will eventually kill him.
    Of course, the supers find it necessary to interfere with the Atom because they believe he killed the Prophet. In the process of trying to bring the Atom to justice, they prevent him from learning the identity of the Shadowman. The Atom can then save the supers from themselves and die in the process. However, before his death the Atom proves his innocents and reveals the existance of the shadow man to the supers.
    I would also make the Raven be the Shadowman. Since he has no powers himself, he makes the perfect character to have a vendetta against all the metahumans. Why? Because the Raven has learned from the Prophet ( I am just using that name because the Oracle was already taken) that metahumans will eventually destroy the world. Since the emergence of metahumans and super, the world has been going to hell in a hand basket. Governments around to world have recruited supers into their ranks, and those countries that don’t have supers have been looking towards technology and science to get their own supers. Then the villains come into play, wreaking havoc and causing destructing for their own ends. Add in the normal geo-policital tensions that have already caused 2 world wars and you have to perfect recipe for armagedon.
    I know all this may sound a little like Marvel’s Ultimate imprint meets The Watchmen, but with enough tweaking you should be able to make it your own. Also, If you don’t like the idea of the Prophet, you could always just make it so that the Raven comes to the understanding that the super’s existence will cause the end of the world. I hope you don’t mind me hijacking your plot like this, but I really like what you have going on here and I could help myself. Although, I am giving you fair warning that if you don’t decide to use it I might end up using it myself.

  35. Ghoston 28 Aug 2010 at 8:58 pm

    Ok, I lied. I would never really steal your story, but I would love to see it writen.

  36. Mr. Crowleyon 29 Aug 2010 at 3:22 pm

    Or there are two shadowmen, by that I mean that there are two men trying to do similar things that often clash with each other, working from the shadows hence they’re title. The Raven is attempting to help save humanity from the meta-human caused apocalypse, going past the moral event horizon in the process. The other is a D-list villain who is currently locked up for life, he is trying to pit two unstoppable forces against each other for his own ends. All the while the two are trying to figure out who the other one is, so while the main plot is happening this side plot is as well, it also calls into question which one killed the Prophet. I want to portray the Raven as a villain and I want some advice on how to make him less of a well intentioned extremist hero and more of an anti-villain.

  37. Ghoston 29 Aug 2010 at 3:55 pm

    Mr. Crowley,
    The two Shadowmen may be hard to pull off for two reasons. First it adds a character that really isn’t necessary, and second it defies the rule of my enemy’s enemy. The question you need to ask yourself is: do you really need two characters where one will do? You need to remember that every character you add draw attention away from your main character. That especially holds true if you intend to use the second Shadowman’s POV. The other thing you have to consider if why would to two fight each other when they have the same goal. Even if they intend to stab one another in the back when it is all over, it behooves the two of them to work together to take down the heroes because they can redirect resources they would need to fight each other at the heroes. As far as Raven, I don’t think he would technically be a villain since he is well intentioned. I mean his motives are not selfish so I dont know.

  38. Mr. Crowleyon 29 Aug 2010 at 4:09 pm

    Well I think that considering that the Raven is a Batman expy to an extent, He is paranoid and wouldn’t trust a person who is known to talk to heroes and give them information on people, If he needed to he would know who to rat out, he’s one of the smartest men in the world and knows who to talk to and what to say. Also while the Raven is trying only to kill the heroes the Prisoner is willing to kill millions to kill maybe 1 hero. The Raven is basically a man trying to do what he thinks is right, but is well past redemption, while the Prisoner is an ends justifies the means and the end is only the begining of something he can control. Also I think the Raven should be a villain, a sympathetic one, but a villain none the less because he is willing to go to technical genocide because of the slight possibility that they could end up destroying the world.

  39. Ghoston 29 Aug 2010 at 4:47 pm

    Okay I can see this going one of two way. First the Raven set the prisoner of as the Shadowman even though he is really to one pulling the string. Either that or the prisoner use the Shadowman’s reputation as a means to his own ends, kind of like someone saying they are the Kingpin even though they aren’t Wilson Fisk. Which ever one you choose though, I think you should always have the true Shadowman be one person. Sure he may let other people use is name a reputation when it suits his needs, but at the end of the day the true Shadowman needs to be the one pulling the string, I guess what I am trying to say is that not having a main antagonist is just as bad as not having main character. I mean sure the Legion of Doom has a bunch of villains, but at the end of the day the readers now the Lex Luthor is running the show.

    As far as the Raven and the prisoner teaming up, you should consider that if the Raven’s goal is to kill all the metahumans, then maybe he is willing to let a few million humans die in his attempt to save billions. Sometimes when you cut out a tumor you have to cut out some healthy tissue along with it.
    And I guess the Raven is a villain, but what I meant was that I don’t think you need to work any harder to make him an anti-villain or even a sympathetic villain. I think readers will understand that this guy is killing his friend not because he enjoys it, but because he believes its a necessary thing to do in order to fulfill his job as a hero. And in many ways the heroes of this story should willingly die if it means saving the world, because isn’t that the whole point of heroes.

  40. Mr. Crowleyon 29 Aug 2010 at 5:04 pm

    It is the whole point of heroes, but I dont think its very human minded to kill yourself selflessly, humans will cling on to life as long as they can because of the fear of death and the unkown, since all of these people are human or where raised by humans I think that there deaths will have a struggle. And I think I can best describe theyre conflict as america an dthe soviet union after the second world war, they both wanted to rebuild eurasia but they had one tiny difference in opinions about government and intead of putting that aside for the better good, they went into the cold war, vietnam and korea, all because of different opinions, though Ive been thinking and I think that the Prisoner should be a side character instead of a main threat, like lecter in red dragon compared to him in silence of the lambs. That way while we see him and we can consider him to be a possible shadowman, the Raven can be the true antagonist of the story.

  41. Ghoston 29 Aug 2010 at 5:32 pm

    Oh sorry that last paragraph was suppose to be me monologuing as Raven. That was how I was picturing his motivation. So now that you have worked out the bad guy, what are you thinking about the plot? Are you going to do just one book, or are you aiming for like a series. Are you going to do it in third person or firs person. I am pretty sure you are doing multiple POVs.

  42. Mr. Crowleyon 30 Aug 2010 at 4:02 pm

    And you would be right, but i intend it to be a comic, not a superhero book. It propably will be a somewhat long series considering we have a whole section of humanity dieing. I think That the plot will be similar to how you described but to put it into more of a definite focus.
    The Prophet is the most powerful magical being of the universe, seeing the past present and future of the world and transcribing what he thinks should exist (Representing the writer, in this case me). He is killed by the Shadowman, who proceeds to frame the Atom, a supervillain. The Atom is then chased while he tries to prove his inocence by finding out who the shadowman is, so he can save his own skin because he knows hes a loose end, but is killed in a fight with the super’s but information on his corpse proves the existance of the shadowman and the heroes try to find out more on him. A few days later the Metropolitan is killed in his civilian identity while on a date in metro city (a tribute to sjilver age metropolis, with retro futuristic architecture)from his body not being able to digest the alchohol in his spiked food (Thanks to you guys for that idea). Now the American government is scared because This one man killed the only thing the americans have over our enemies, and the Middle east is develping there own human bombs that are unnoticable to known tests. A private detective known as Victor A. Crime (tribute to Steve Ditko) comes into play and begins investigating into this, Interviewing the Prisoner (also representing me, but in this case my views on things, but not unneeded) about what he knows about the murders.He says that even if something seems to be the end they is always something else, that noone accounted for. He goes on to say that not every hero is trustworthy as they want people to believe. The next day Crime learns that the person he interviewed was found dead from cyanide in his water. Crime is killed by a seemingly random drive-by shooting. We then switch views to the Raven who is on the roofs of Berten after Mr. Grin (the people in Berten, including Mr. Grin and the Raven, are a tribute to Tim Burton, especially the Batman films), Raven is thinking about how he wished he had superpowers, but will settle for his gadgets. Grin is found at the bottom of a ladder, unconscience, but is revealed to be a homeless man. Later we see Grin apply makeup to his scared face, to make his clown appearance. He is talking to a coated figure, who is standing in shadows (symbolism my dear friends). They are talking about a deal that Mr. Grin will lead his villains in a revolt at a later date. We cut to russia, where we see a russian kgb in a charred room, searching through twisted bodies. They talk about what they’ve gathered. We go into a flashback showing a special ops team, consisting of russian heroes the harbinger, Arsenal, and Cronos, confronting middle eastern human bomb prototypes, they ask them who sent them after disabling the bombs to which they reply the shadows and reveal a portable sound wave generator, activating it to a frequency that destroys harbingers energy source along with everything in a five block radius. We go into the present and see the KGB members leaving the scene into they’re car, which we see has a bomb strapped to the bottom. We go to Asia and see them experimenting on human test subjects, trying to find the formula used to power the Colonel, a dead american hero from the second world war, and we see a experiment going on that result with the subject exploding, taking the entire complex with it. Now we go back to the american continent where news copters are circleing around a giant warzone full of heroes and villains destroying buildings, we see in the middle the Raven holding Mr. Grin surronded by Grins dead men. Grin comments on how he thought Hed be happy with the results before taking a blade to the juggler (this is based on the burton batman, thought I should remind you). We see that in the surronding debris there are millions dead and one dieing, a heavily wounded Bearer talking to a less wounded Green Streak, about how he knows this is from the Shadowman, he just does. He dies in GS’s arms. GS proceeds to continue on leads to find out who the Shadowman is and looks into Crimes notes and listens to Prisoners interview, interested in the part about heroes, he goes to the prisoners cell, finding in his cane a feather of a raven. GS “jumps” to Ravens headquarters to find it set to explode in 1 second. Outside we see the Raven ripping his mask off seemingly talking to himself about how the Prophet told him about the Meta human caused apocalypsem and that his actions are justified in his eyes because he saved the human race. Going on he talks about how he isnt the first “Shadowman” and that they are behind every rise and fall in history, one of the oldest conspiracies in history, we change views to see another figure shrouded in the shadows (the final representation of the writer as the final judge and jury of a characters existence and value, at least until the next writer comes along) holding a pistol, discharging a round into the Ravens head, he then drops the gun and walks away.

    I know that a lot of these details will change but this is the plot right now.

  43. Ghoston 30 Aug 2010 at 4:50 pm

    Mr. Crowley,
    Your plot summary sounds good, although I have one problem with it. First, let me say that I am a white middle American male who servered six years in the Army and spent some time in the middle east. That being said, I think it is a little culturally insensitive and stereotypical to make the middle eastern metahumans suicide bombers. Remember that suicide bombing is a terrorist tacit and not one generally used by governments. If the middle eastern bomber are terrorist, then I think that it would be more appropriate than if they were soldiers for a middle eastern government. I hope I have not offended you or misunderstood your post, but its a possible problem I see.

  44. Mr. Crowleyon 31 Aug 2010 at 3:07 pm

    just reread it and I realize how rascist that sounded. I meant it in that Al queda was using human subjects in human bomb experiments, not that the entire government was working on this, that would be intentionaly rascist. I chose to make the only scientific experiments from them instead of the government making there own because Osama is a rich bastard and has millions to fund things like this if it existed. Sorry if that offended you.

  45. Mr. Crowleyon 31 Aug 2010 at 3:09 pm

    crap the last sentence came out wrong, I meant if the part of the plot summary offended you, not the comment post explaining what I meant offended you.

  46. Ghoston 31 Aug 2010 at 3:16 pm

    No you didn’t offend me, but I wanted to make sure you were aware that it might offend other. I think it would be appropriate and acceptable. If that is what you were talking about in the first place then I am sorry to have jumped on you about, bt your post wasn’t really clear.

  47. Ghoston 31 Aug 2010 at 7:37 pm

    Wow sorry for my last post, I was using my cell phone. What I meant to say was that I was not offended. I just wanted to point out to you that it might be offensive to some people. I wasn’t sure if you meant terrorist or middle eastern countries in general. I think that is appropriate if you want to use terrrorists as superpowered suicide bombers. I don’t think anyone would be offended by that, but also consider the cost of making on of these superbombers. It may not be cost effective to train and make a super terrorist if the destruction they wreak isn’t significant. Although. the downside is you don’t want to make them to over powered. I would go with something in the in the area of 50 to 60 pound of C4. That gives you a kill zone of about 50 meters in each direction of the target, and a minimum safe distance of 369 meters(note that minimum safe distance is the distance at which there is almost a 0% change of injury). At about 100 pounds of C4 your talking about a blast that could drop most office building. I think nuclear size blast from a superterrorist my be a little over kill but maybe not.
    Also, if you are planning to use outside power that threaten the US don’t forget North Korea, Iran, Venezueal, or China. I know we are friendly with China now, but they are the new 800 pound gorilla on the block. So I think they would make a good candidate for a Superhuman cold war.
    Another idea you might want to consider is starting your plot with the superterrorists. I think that way Raven’s vendetta against the supers will be more believable. Sorry again for highjacking your story, and remember I am just making suggestions so you don’t have to use them.

  48. Mr. Crowleyon 01 Sep 2010 at 2:37 pm

    I think I put in there that asia is attempting to recreat a world war II heroes powers and it was sabatoged. Well I think north korea has little to no money, might want to check on that point, might not be valid anymore but for all I know it might still be. And I like the idea of a superhuman war, standstill now. Instead of an arms race we had a superhuman creation race, which might still have leftovers today. Sorry but could you explain what you mean with start the plot with the terrorists I dont understand what that meant, if you could elaborate that would be good.

  49. NicKennyon 01 Sep 2010 at 2:42 pm

    I like the plot. This could be really good. Keep on going.

  50. Ghoston 01 Sep 2010 at 3:49 pm

    First off, North Korea is not that poor. I mean if they have the money to build Nuclear weapons then they should have enough money to build super soldiers. Remember that super powers are not different then nuclear weapons, once the research is done the cost of making each individual unit is rather small. So North Korea, Iran, Venezuela, or China doesn’t have to develop the process for making supers, they just have to be able to get a hold of the process just like the did with nuclear bombs.
    What I meant when I said start with the terrorists is have that be the focus of your first story novel/graphic novel/six issues of your comic. That way you can establish and introduce all of your characters to your readers, and develop the motive for why Raven decides to wipe out all the supers. So the story line would look something like this: The Superhuman arms race has been going on for like five years. American and the European Union have been trying to prevent radical countries in the middle east and Asia from developing super humans. Diplomatically, American and China have been squaring off over super humans and global resource. No violence had occurred, but tensions are high. For the last five years or so Raven has worked with Metropolitan (a good friend) and other superheroes to keep American civilians safe and international relief. Then suddenly in Washington D.C. a superterrorist goes off and everyone starts pointing fingers at one another. The blame game starts to escalate and before anyone realizes what is going on the world is on the brink of war. In the meantime, the all of the American supers expect for Raven decide to track down the people behind to bombing. The Raven disagrees with them because he feels that they are essentially abusing their power and illegally invading foreign nations. However, Metropolitan convinces him by stating that they need someone like the Raven so they don’t go over board. So the Raven agrees and they hunt down the people responsible (you can choose whoever you want to responsible). In the end, the supers have stopped the superterrorists, but damaged their credibility with American and other nations for taking matters into their own hands. The supers have also confirmed the Raven’s lost standing suspicions that the supers would one day abuse their powers. So in response to the news that their are rouge organizations creating superterrorists and supers running around unsupervised, the Raven decides that the supers are a danger to the world and must be stopped.
    So that was the basic idea that I was talking about in my last post.

  51. Mr. Crowleyon 01 Sep 2010 at 3:58 pm

    Thanks for elaborating. That is a good idea actually, it makes sense and introduces the world. What I meant by North Korea is poor is I heard that they had a falling economy, obviously that meant there government had all the money, should have thought about that more. I think I can also put the prisoner in here as the one who developed the human bomb process, He is in prison waiting for death row. comments on that please, I dont know much about the american policy on developing a process for untraceable bombs…just guessing its very high. But I do know that it can take years for people to be executed. You know this just reminded me of Identity Crisis, the part where the supers do something batman doesnt like and he makes OMAC.

  52. Ghoston 01 Sep 2010 at 4:16 pm

    I am not a big fan of DC comics. Personally, I think they have some of the worst editorial staff ever. I mean some of the thing they let writers do to iconic characters is just terrible. I am actually more a fan of DC’s animated universe so that is really the extent of my knowledge on DC. I think using the prisoner at this point would be a good idea. As far as the amount of time an inmate spends on death row, I think that depends on the state. However, it is such an obscure detail that I think you could fake it. As far as the super terrorists go, I think 9/11 and Illegal immigrants have shown that anyone who really wants to get into the US can. I mean as long as the super bombers look human on the outside, they could probably just fly into the country and make it through customs not problem. This is especially true if the US government has only scattered intel on the organization making the super bombers.

  53. Mr. Crowleyon 01 Sep 2010 at 4:43 pm

    Well dc has released some crap recently, countdown to final crisis Im looking at you, but theve released some good stuff as well, sinestro corps war, blackest night, and 52 to name a few. For comparisons sake marvel has released One more day and brand new day, ultimatum, civil war, and secret invasion off the top of my head.

  54. Ghoston 01 Sep 2010 at 5:06 pm

    Yeah recently DC has been ok, but honestly it their past mistakes that really turn me off from them. I mean there history was so convoluted that they had to recon everything in 85. My favorite DC work are usually their non canon short series like justice and kingdom come. My biggest problem with DC is the characters not the stories. I mean readmthe wiki page on superboy and tell me his history isn’t convoluted.
    I know marvel has it’s problems too, but they don’t butcher characters like DC does. Also, I liked civil war because it was very emotionally suspenseful. I mean come on , captain America and iron man going head to head. How could that not tug at your heart strings :). Althought, don’t even get me started on what marvel did to captian America after the civil war. The event that shall not be named was the dumbest move marvel ever made. Those pinko commies, don’t they know cap is a fricken American institution. He even more important to america than president. It goes cap, superman, the president b

  55. B. Macon 01 Sep 2010 at 6:44 pm

    “I mean readmthe wiki page on superboy and tell me his history isn’t convoluted.” Alternate dimensions and multiple universes in general strike me as helluva confusing.

    Also, I’m annoyed when comic companies slot multiple characters into the same identity. For example, the mantle of the Flash has been held by Jay Garrick, Barry Allen, Wally West and Bart Allen and the main character in “Green Lantern” has been Alan Scott, Hal Gordon, John Stewart, Guy Gardner and Kyle Rayner. (Not to mention the other Green Lanterns that go by different titles). The different Robins, etc.

    Marvel dabbled in that by making Ben Riley Spiderman for a time, but mercifully Marvel is pretty consistent about sticking with the same character over decades.

    *It’d probably be less confusing if the superhero name was unique to him rather than a position held by many characters. If everybody in the Green Lantern Corps is a Green Lantern, “Green Lantern” is probably not a very effective name.

  56. Ghoston 01 Sep 2010 at 6:55 pm

    Dang skippy B. Mac.

  57. B. Macon 01 Sep 2010 at 6:56 pm

    Skippy?

  58. Ghoston 02 Sep 2010 at 5:11 am

    What? Its a word, an besides there are child on this forum :).

  59. B. Macon 02 Sep 2010 at 8:04 am

    What does “dang skippy” mean?

  60. Ghoston 02 Sep 2010 at 8:38 am

    Its the kiddy version of Dam straight. Stop being so judgmental B. Mac I was drinking last night when I posted that :).

  61. Mr. Crowleyon 02 Sep 2010 at 3:18 pm

    well youve got a point in that dc’s history tends to be confusing, but I think that people should just by the paperback, thats what I do. I feel that civil war was poorly written with several characters being derailed just because they needed to to make the story work, I mean come on. In civil war tony stark turned from a hero into a complete jackass fascist and steve initiated a plan with no chance of success for no reason. Also considering the fact that no one could figure out who was correct and several writers disagreed and ended up screwing the whole thing up story wise. Also the logic behind causing a giant war because of one law, which any normal person would just go to court about, even if they are a superhero thats not an excuse to beat the shit out of everyone. thats my two cents. Dang Skippy.

  62. Lighting Manon 02 Sep 2010 at 4:35 pm

    I agree that Civil War had a multitude of problems, but I really wouldn’t list the motivations of the anti-registration side as one of the problems. The out-of-character portrayal of the civilians and many of the powerless characters, yes, but it wasn’t like the registration act was a blue law or something else minor, it was armed forces charging up to your house, kicking in the door and stealing your fingerprints or tossing you in another dimension, and treating you like you’d been caught buggering the neighbor’s’ kid instead of being a hero, by putting your image and name on a list available for viewing by anyone with enough clearance or money.

    I can’t really say that Captain America acted out of character at all until the very resolution, particularly the dying part, and it was the closest I’d seen Steve Rogers to the intent of the character in a very long time. Plus, thinking as a character in the universe might, can you imagine how many Aunt Mays and Mary Janes would’ve ruined kitchen appliances in the years it would take for a Supreme Court case to reach them?

    It would have been very yucky, all that dairy would have to be thrown out.

    http://www.unheardtaunts.com/wir/women.html (Joke explanation link!)

  63. B. Macon 02 Sep 2010 at 5:18 pm

    I think outing Peter Parker was a mistake. They had to use a deal with the devil to retcon that one.

  64. Ghoston 02 Sep 2010 at 6:08 pm

    I will admit that the whole spider-man retcon was absolutely terrible. Bad Marvel, Bad Bad Marvel.

  65. Mr. Crowleyon 04 Sep 2010 at 12:25 pm

    I want to change the title to something else but all got is guardsmen, in reference to who guards the guards.

  66. Ghoston 04 Sep 2010 at 1:37 pm

    Eh… I think that is to close to the watchmen especially if you use that saying.

  67. NicKennyon 04 Sep 2010 at 3:48 pm

    I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the title. When Gods Fall has a nice ring to it. Guardsmen, however, is a very bad idea. WAY too similar to Watchmen.

  68. ShardReaperon 04 Sep 2010 at 5:30 pm

    I’m pretty sure having your title be even the slightest bit close to Watchmen will land you in some legal doodoo. I agree with NicKenny, When Gods Fall has a nice ring.

  69. Ghoston 04 Sep 2010 at 5:58 pm

    Or when the Might Fall, but when the Gods fall is also good.

  70. Mr. Crowleyon 04 Sep 2010 at 6:18 pm

    Well I thought I should change it because I thought it might be to wordy and I thought perhaps I should change it to something simpler but if you guys like it then I going to keep it.

  71. Mr. Crowleyon 05 Sep 2010 at 8:38 am

    Since I think weve got everything down I was thinking of putting a scene in the end that shows the raven wasnt successful and that there are still meta humans. It shows a kid opening up a fridge door and the handle is almost ripped off and he imedeatly freaks out. I also thought about doing a sequel that ties into that and shows the government assembling a team of anyone they can find with powers and they kidnap the before mentioned kid and introduce him to a team of young adults including a person who dreams the future, the catch is that the worst the dream is the more likely its true while the nicer ones are 95 percent of the time wrong. I was wondering ifanyone can help me think of a plot.

  72. Ghoston 05 Sep 2010 at 12:51 pm

    I like the ending, it very poetic. As far as the sequel goes, I think you should make the young boy really young, like 3, when he rips the door off. Then have the government kidnap him and raise him as a human weapon (since there are almost no superhumans left). You could then show his life growing up as a weapon and his eventual disillusionment with the lies and secrets. This eventually leads to him coming into conflict with the government and of course the Raven, since the raven believes that the boy is trying to take over the world. If you really want to throw in a twist you could make the boy the son of Metropolitan, and the Raven’s god son. You could even entitle the story line “The Sins of the Father”

  73. ShardReaperon 05 Sep 2010 at 5:00 pm

    I think the boy should be a little bit older than what Ghost’s going for, like 5 or 6. His idea sounds like the best thing to go for for the sequel, if you chose to use it.

  74. Ghoston 05 Sep 2010 at 7:41 pm

    ShardReaper,
    I don’t think he should be that young for the book itself, I just think he should be taken by the government at a young age. If he is even a little bit older he would probably remember enough to know that the government was lying to him from the beginning. For the main action of the book, I think he should be early adolescence through late teens. Nothing like an over powered brat on a ramage.
    What I am thinking is that during the first story arc, Metropolitan sends his wife and young child into hiding when the Super’s war starts because of the action taken by the Raven. While supers and villains are duking it out, the Raven fakes his own death while attempting to take down the Shadowman. Now free to play the heroes against the villains. As they slowly kill each other, the Raven moves in to finish off Metropolitan himself. During their final battle, the Raven reveals that in the wake of the super terrorist bombings, he felt that killing all the metahumans off was the only way to save the world from an even larger scale war than the one he started. As Metropolitan slowly dies, is final thoughts are of his wife and son, who are safely hidden away. Then cut to the scene of Metropolitan’s wife and son several days after the final Battle watching the news coverage about the murders of suspected metahuman who did not participate in any of the battles. The boy leaves the living room and walks into the kitchen, where he tears the door off the refrigerator.
    Terrified that her son will be killed by the person hunting down metahumans, the boy’s mother contacts the government for protection. The government, who is scrambling to fill the void in their defense plans following the metahuman apocalypes, readily takes the boy and his mother into custody. After realizing the boy potential though, the government decides to separate the boy from his mother in order to have a Mertopolitan powered solider at their disposal. They take the boy and several other metashildren and place them in a tightyl controlled and isolated environment. There, the children are forced to endure harsh physical traing and propagand based brain washing. Eventually though, the children find out the truth about what the government has done to them and decide they don’t need to follow the orders of morally corrupt people.
    I don’t think that this should all be written in this order, I’m just kinda spitballing some history here. Most of what I wrote should really be back story, although I’ve noticed that in comics they don’t mind doing some montages to gloss over back stories.

  75. Mr. Crowleyon 06 Sep 2010 at 4:35 pm

    I was thinking of something among the lines of this.
    The kid is taken into government services (read kidnapped) at age 15 and is introduced to the rest of the team. A blind 13 year old with prophetic dreams/nightmares (morpheus), a cynical 18 year old with energy projection powers (Apollo), and a 16 year old telepath with slight confidence problems (Psyche). He goes through traing and tests showing as well as strength he has denser muscle tissue wich makes small calibur guns and knifes effectless on him. The kid is given the name Metro Boy and is told to pretend he is the son of the Metroplitan. No one is able to tell the others there real name because the government doesnt want them to get close. They are then given a base of operations from a private benefactor and former hero equiment builder the Watchmaker.
    They deal with a minor uprising in Berten between Mr. Grins old Mafia group and a new one led by Mask Face, a former right hand man. This leads them to there first media appearance in the nation and leads to them being debated if this is good or bad. We see that Morpheus’s dreams are getting progressivly worse and that Psyche and Metro Boy are striking up a relationship. While the Watchmaker is thinking of “Corpses in my closet” before being dismissed we see an arm from behind a slightly open door.
    We see Morpheus walking in the passage ways of the house/base before he stops infront of Apollo’s room. We here from inside a meeting before a gunshot and Morpheus running to the others, running into things because of his blindness. He runs in on Psyche and Metro Boy making out, which they attempt t cover up before Morpheus says that he and everyone else all ready knew they where together. He remembers what he needs say and tells them that Apollo is dead, he went to check for the shot just a while ago. This gets Metro Boy angery because he could have stopped it, To which Morpheus rebutes with “what help could a blind kid do?”. Metro Boy storms off to report to the Watchmaker who is siting facing the door with a revolver in his hand. We finally see his face to see the Prisoner, who had survived his cyanide poisoning and hacked into the computers to pronounce himself legally dead.
    He shoots Metro Boy in the forehead which knocks him out. When he wakes up he is surrounded by field agents in a crime scene, he is asked ot describe the man and is given his backstory after they get a positive id. He goes to Apollos room and we see that they where working together for something but whatever it is they cannot find out what. We go to a hospital and its shown that Morpheus is in critical condition from a collapsed lung from a revolver round. We go ahead a few hours and see that the Prisoner is in the cemetary of Berten infront of the Ravens grave, paying his respects and cursing his name for doing something he was going to attempt, but tha the might still get what he wants. He walks away and we see that the grave stone has a feather left on top. We cut to Metro Boy and Psyche contemplating sex in there new base of operations after the last one was labled a crime zone. They are talking when Psyche accidentally calls him by his real name, Metro notices and gets angry that she would go into his privacy like that and storms out while shes attempting to apologize.
    I cannot think of an appropriate ending, if anyone would like to contribute to this that would be great.

  76. Mr. Crowleyon 15 Sep 2010 at 6:12 pm

    I need a point of view character… I think that when gods fall would suffer without one, because it would be harder to connnect, at the end of each book the person ends up dieing. Secondary problem, every time I try to come up with one it is some kind of rorshach like person. any help.

    in other news ive decided to cut it down to one series but to add elements from the other two into it. EX: Metro boy is a sports team mascot from metro city, the watchmeaker is a minor character, the terrorist event is mentioned by the prisoner. etc.

  77. Mr. Crowleyon 16 Sep 2010 at 2:11 pm

    All I can think of is retooling vic into a more important character, but I dont want this to become to much like rorsach, as posted above I dont want that to happen. Any help with this?

  78. Mr. Crowleyon 16 Sep 2010 at 2:11 pm

    I meant to much like watchmen, my bad

  79. B. Macon 17 Sep 2010 at 9:46 am

    I’m headed out the door at the moment, but I’ll work on this as soon as I get back. If I haven’t posted anything by tomorrow, please leave me a reminder anywhere.

  80. B. Macon 17 Sep 2010 at 4:58 pm

    –Why doesn’t the government want them getting close? Why does the government want Metro Boy to lie about being Metropolitan’s son?

    –I like the aspect of using Morpheus’ dreams as foreshadowing.

    –“This leads them to their first media appearance… and leads to them being debated if this is good or bad.” This feels sort of tacked-on to me. The idea of the media/public debating the value of the heroes has already been used sort of heavily, so I’d only recommend venturing into that territory if your heart is really in it and ideally if you have a unique angle/spin that we haven’t seen before. (For example, maybe we’re supposed to sympathize with the media flacks saying that the heroes actually are more of a problem than the solution, or that the whole setup smacks of child abuse or something, which it sort of does).

    –“What help could [I] a blind kid do?” It sounds like he has worse self-esteem issues than Psyche. Is that consistent with his characterization?

    –For the ending, you might do something like resolving the conflict between the kids and their government handlers and/or the conflict between the kids and the Prisoner, sorting out the skeletons in the Watchmaker’s closet, the romance/intimacy issues between Psyche and Metro Boy, maybe one of the more important kids (probably the 15 year old) trying to get back to where he was before the government kidnapped him, etc.

    –The newest addition to the team (the 15 year old) strikes me as the most intuitive point-of-view character. His arrival on the team and/or kidnapping by the government appears to be the inciting event of the story (the incident that puts the plot in motion).

    –I don’t feel that making Vic a more significant character would make the story too reminiscent of Watchmen. There’s a throwaway pair of detectives at the very start of Watchmen, but 1) it doesn’t sound like Vic serves the same role in your story and 2) they’re such a minor part of Watchmen that I don’t think readers will draw the connection.

  81. Mr. Crowleyon 17 Sep 2010 at 5:27 pm

    When Morpheus says that its more like a sarcastic answer than a lack of self confidence, it kinda referencing the fact that people dont expect much from handicapped people, metro boy being one of them, constintaly saying how he should be careful not get in the way, and all of a sudden he yells at him for not helping someone. Morpheus is a generally dark character, complete with dark humor and sarcasm. The government doesnt want them getting close because they might get attatched to each other and they dont want any heroic BSOD’s, because that would waste time and rescources. They want Metro Boy to pretend to be Metropolitans son because I think that if theres someone who is similar to something gone it inspire people. I dont know if that would work in real life but its a physcological idea i came up with.

  82. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Sep 2010 at 3:18 pm

    Heres all the script Ive got. Its taken me about 6 days to do this.

  83. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Sep 2010 at 3:18 pm

    Page 1
    [1]
    Wide panel. The panel is black. This is in first person and they are unconscious. Sirens go off in the back ground, far off from where we are.

    [2]
    Wide panel. The eyes open up and we see the top of a parking garage, its gray and paneled with one florescent light in view but only slightly, possibly a crack is in the ceiling. The sirens are closer

    ATOM: Where…the hell?

    [3]
    This one take up the rest of the page. We are third person now and we see the Atom surrounded by police men, there are five of them with two cars. He is in a black jumpsuit like outfit and is visibly startled by the appearance of the police men. His skin is partly see through veins and muscle show through. Beside him is a 12 year old wearing all white with blind apparatus on him, this one is visibly dead. Two or three of the 5 officers have pistols out and are aiming them directly at the Atom, they are about ten feet from him and the corpse. The parking lot is empty save them and a few cars, this is first floor parking with multiple exits.

    POLICE MAN: SIR, HANDS IN THE AIR, YOU ARE UNDER ARREST.

    ATOM: Go…AWAY

    Page 2
    [1]
    Wide panel. We see the Atoms hand raised releasing a blast of radiation, perhaps it looks like Kirby dots. The background is blotted out by the light of the blast.
    [2]
    Wide panel. We see the police blown back by the blast one of the cars is flipped the other is pushed back a few feet. The cops are unconscious.
    [3]
    Wide panel. The Atom gets fully off the ground. The garage is darker because a few lights are destroyed by the blast
    [4]
    Normal panel. We see the atom getting a jacket off of one of the cops.
    [5]
    Normal panel. The atom is walking out of the parking garage into the city he has found himself in. the corpse is visible in the lower right corner. The before mentioned jacket having been donned.

    Page 3
    [1]
    Splash page. The atom is walking through the streets of the town, holding the jacket close to himself slightly hunched to try to hide his face from people. A few lamps are on but a few are broken. There is trash blowing through the streets, rusted chain link fences guarding a few alley ways. Windows are cracked with a few boarded over with wood. A strip club is close on the other side of the street.

    CAPTION [A]: Where am I?

    Page 4
    [1]
    Normal panel. We close in on the side of the Atoms face as he contemplates what has happened to him, he has a puzzled expression. He has his head down still. He is still walking. In the background we see the strip club neon glowing brightly, we see the light through his epidermis, the muscles colored bluish.

    CAPTION [A]: More importantly…

    CAPTION[A]: What just happened.

    [2]
    Normal panel. We are still closed in on the side of his face. His expression is more angry then before but still puzzled. His head is higher up as he notices no one is around. He continues to walk. The strip club is behind him the back of his head blue from the light.

    CAPTION[A]: I am surrounded by cops…In a parking garage?

    CAPTION[A]: I’ve done crimes, but…recently I’ve been laying low…

    [3]
    Normal panel. We are seeing his full front. He has a blank expression. He has fully stopped where he is. The background is an old brick building with knocked over trashcans partially in an ally behind a chain link fence. Weeds grow in the dirt spaces between the concrete.

    CAPTION [A]: But that body…

    [4]
    Normal panel. He is still standing there. His expression now puzzled again.

    CAPTION [A]: That kid…

    [5]
    Wide panel. We are in the alley, the chain link fence between us and him. Shadows cover him almost entirely

    CAPTION [A]: That body doesn’t add up.

    Page 5
    [1]
    Normal panel. Close up of the Atoms face as he looks behind him, multiple sirens are far away and getting closer.
    [2]
    Normal panel. We are behind the chain link fence again, the Atom is in the process of jumping over it. The sirens are louder.
    [3]
    Normal panel. The sirens are incredibly close as the Atom ducks behind the trash cans.
    [4]
    Normal panel. The ambulances go past as the Atom is barely visible in the shadows.
    [5]
    Wide panel. We are behind the ambulances now, one of them hits a puddle and the water sprays onto the sidewalk. In the closest one we see part of someone’s face as he talks to another, both of these are distorted by the window tint.
    [6]
    Wide panel. We get closer to this ambulance, the distorted faces are more normal but still twisted by the tinted windows.

    Page 6
    [1]
    Wide panel. We are right next to the windows, a body bag ,blocked by the area between the windows, lies between two figures who are framed by the rubber, the sheriff old and wrinkled with a thick mustache, pair of aviators over his eyes, and Dante Miller, Dante is wear a green jacket over a loose white buttoned shirt, a pair of bifocal glasses on the edge of his nose, lies the body bag. His face is pale and calm with short cut hair, the sheriff is angered and red, bald with blond hair where it grows.
    [2]
    Normal panel. Sheriffs side of the Ambulance, the body bag in the lower right corner of the vehicle. His eyes are peaking from behind the aviators. His head is leaned forward as well as his shoulders, key is intimidation here.

    SHERIFF: You shouldn’t even be in here.

    [3]
    Normal panel. Dante‘s side of the ambulance. The body bag now in the lower left. His hand is adjusting his glasses back to the bridge of his nose. Other hand on his knee. His back completely straight.

    DANTE: But I am.

    [4]
    Normal panel. We go back to the sheriff’s side. His eyes now behind his aviators. His skin is less red now but still angered. His back straight with arms crossed on his lap

    SHERIFF: Don’t get smart with me. I am your superior in both age and experience.

    [5]
    Normal panel. Back to Dante’s side of the ambulance, his face still calm and pale. Arms on his thighs with his hands hanging limply in between his open legs, his arms holding him up.

    DANTE: That may be but I am still here and you are going to have to deal with it.

    Page 7
    [1]
    Normal panel. Sheriff’s side of the Ambulance. He is now putting his aviators in his shirt pocket. His face now calm and his skin back to normal, he isn’t looking at Dante anymore but at his hands.

    SHERIFF: Fair enough…But none of this gets to the press, or I’ll have your head.
    [2]
    Television panel. In this we have a plucky looking red head with a slightly 50’s hair style. She is dressed conservatively with a pair of ruby earrings. She is remarkably pale with a bright red lip stick color, a certain surprise is on her face as she reads this.

    RED HEAD REPORTER: This is the Metro-City nine o’clock news. We have gotten reports from police that they have found the corpse of a twelve year old in a parking garage located in Ditko City.

    [3]
    Television panel. The reporter is looking down at the paper she reads with a smile returned to her face from happier news.

    RED HEAD REPORTER: On a happier note, the Metro-City Metro Boys mini league baseball team will be facing-

    [4]
    Normal panel. Dante’s side of the ambulance, He is about to stand up.

    DANTE: Understood. We’re here.

    [5]
    Wide panel. We see both the sheriff and Dante outside the ambulance holding the doors open as the stretcher and body bag is rushed pushed out.

    Page 8
    [1]
    Wide panel. We see the police morgue building. Dante and the sheriff are small silhouettes next to the building. They are following the stretcher as it exit’s the ambulance which is parked parallel to the building. Dante is lighting a cigarette.
    [2]
    Wide panel. We see both of them still walking silhouettes, the cigarette being held up to his mouth, a mist of smoke surrounding him, other hand in his pocket. The cigarette is now halfway gone
    [3]
    Wide panel. Both are still walking silhouettes as they enter a door labeled examination room. The cigarette is a stub as he drops and steps on it.
    [4]
    Wide panel. Both are now walking out of the dark into the light, shedding the darkness that clung to them.

  84. B. Macon 21 Sep 2010 at 6:17 pm

    “Where am I?” (Page 3) –> This is telling us he doesn’t know where he is. I think you could show this instead, particularly since we have some idea that he’s confused about his location in page 2, panel 1. For example, maybe gazing confused at something.

    I like the aspect of him hiding from people. I think that adds to the sense of him being lost.

    “More importantly… What just happened?” If you’re going to exposition this, I’d recommend doing it with more style. For example, if he’s usually a methodical guy (I don’t know), maybe he lists facts he knows and we can surmise from that what he doesn’t know (for example, depending on how he describes the dead kid he just woke up next to, we can probably infer that he doesn’t remember who the kid is).

    In the paragraph that introduces Dante Miller, it may help to give a few words about who Dante Miller is and/or what role he plays in the story right now. I got confused when the sheriff said “You shouldn’t even be here” because I had assumed from the visual description that he was something like the town coroner or a doctor.

    “But I am.” What would you think about “Neither should he. But here we are.”?

    “Don’t get smart with me. I am your superior in both age and experience.” This second sentence could probably be shortened into a single word, like “Don’t get smart with me, greenhorn.” Or maybe “rookie” or “kid” or “boy.”

    It might help if Dante did something on page six in addition to simply telling the Sheriff that he’s there and that the sheriff will have to deal with it. He doesn’t do much on page 7, either. At the very least, he could foreshadow what he’s going to do when he gets there?

    I like the aspect of the sheriff having to be secretive (don’t let the press know). It may be worthwhile suggesting why he thinks it’d be a problem if it got out Miller were working on the case.

    When you’re ready to do rewrites, I suspect that pages 6 and 7 could probably be condensed significantly. For one thing, 7-2 could probably be removed and/or replaced with a panel that somehow develops the scene with information we didn’t have before. (We already knew the kid was dead, right?) 7-4 could be removed, and Dante’s response either moved to 7-1 in the form of a verbal and/or visual cue.

    Based on the sheriff not having a name here, but Dante Miller* getting a first and last name, I’d assume that Dante is a more important character. If so, I’d recommend giving him a more distinct physical description.

    I suspect page 8 could also be pared down. I suspect it isn’t necessary to spend a page getting them from the ambulance to the examination room. One possibility would be having one panel end with “We’re here,” the next panel showing them taking the stretcher into the police morgue, and then the next one showing them walking into the examination room. With the use of a caption like “METRO CITY POLICE MORGUE,” you might even be able to cut it to just two panels. If the cigarette is important, you might be able to move that into the ambulance. (It’d probably seem more distinct there, anyway–who smokes in an ambulance? 🙂 ).

    *I’m assuming this is a reference to Frank Miller, and either way it’s unintrusive because Miller is a common name. Ditko City, not so much. 😉

    I think the pace stalls a bit when we move from Atom to Dante & the sheriff. It might help if we learned more about Dante (and possibly the sheriff, if he is a recurring character) and/or if more happened during the time we were with them. Right now, it looks like the only thing going on is an ambulance ride to the morgue. One way to develop this would be to heighten the foreshadowing by establishing what Dante is there to do, and possibly why the sheriff would have a problem with him being there.

    This looks pretty good. Please post some more pages soon.

  85. Mr. Crowleyon 26 Sep 2010 at 4:01 pm

    Ive edited the script a bit, and I have finished it up, but I dont think its long enough, its only about 16 pages. Im posting it next.

  86. Mr. Crowleyon 26 Sep 2010 at 4:02 pm

    Page 1
    [1]
    Wide panel. The panel is black. This is in first person and they are unconscious. Sirens go off in the back ground, far off from where we are.

    [2]
    Wide panel. The eyes open up and we see the top of a parking garage, its gray and paneled with one florescent light in view but only slightly, possibly a crack is in the ceiling. The sirens are closer

    ATOM: Where…the hell?

    [3]
    This one take up the rest of the page. We are third person now and we see the Atom surrounded by police men, there are five of them with two cars. He is in a black jumpsuit like outfit and is visibly startled by the appearance of the police men. His skin is partly see through veins and muscle show through. Beside him is a 12 year old wearing all white with blind apparatus on him, this one is visibly dead. Two or three of the 5 officers have pistols out and are aiming them directly at the Atom, they are about ten feet from him and the corpse. The parking lot is empty save them and a few cars, this is first floor parking with multiple exits.

    POLICE MAN: SIR, HANDS IN THE AIR, YOU ARE UNDER ARREST.

    ATOM: Go…AWAY

    Page 2
    [1]
    Wide panel. We see the Atoms hand raised releasing a blast of radiation, perhaps it looks like Kirby dots. The background is blotted out by the light of the blast.
    [2]
    Wide panel. We see the police blown back by the blast one of the cars is flipped the other is pushed back a few feet. The cops are unconscious.
    [3]
    Wide panel. The Atom gets fully off the ground. The garage is darker because a few lights are destroyed by the blast
    [4]
    Normal panel. We see the atom getting a jacket off of one of the cops.
    [5]
    Normal panel. The atom is walking out of the parking garage into the city he has found himself in. the corpse is visible in the lower right corner. The before mentioned jacket having been donned.

    Page 3
    [1]
    Splash page. The atom is walking through the streets of the town, holding the jacket close to himself slightly hunched to try to hide his face from people. A few lamps are on but a few are broken. There is trash blowing through the streets, rusted chain link fences guarding a few alley ways. Windows are cracked with a few boarded over with wood. A strip club is close on the other side of the street.

    CAPTION [A]: Where am I?

    Page 4
    [1]
    Normal panel. We close in on the side of the Atoms face as he contemplates what has happened to him, he has a puzzled expression. He has his head down still. He is still walking. In the background we see the strip club neon glowing brightly, we see the light through his epidermis, the muscles colored bluish.

    CAPTION [A]: What just happened?

    CAPTION[A]: Last I remember I was laying low in England. Now I’m in America? I wake up in a…parking garage?

    [2]
    Normal panel. We are still closed in on the side of his face. His expression is more angry then before but still puzzled. His head is higher up as he notices no one is around. He continues to walk. The strip club is behind him the back of his head blue from the light.

    CAPTION[A]: I am surrounded by cops upon awaking

    CAPTION[A]: I’ve done crimes, but…I left the country two month’s ago.

    [3]
    Normal panel. We are seeing his full front. He has a blank expression. He has fully stopped where he is. The background is an old brick building with knocked over trashcans partially in an ally behind a chain link fence. Weeds grow in the dirt spaces between the concrete.

    CAPTION [A]: But that body…

    [4]
    Normal panel. He is still standing there. His expression now puzzled again.

    CAPTION [A]: That kid…

    [5]
    Wide panel. We are in the alley, the chain link fence between us and him. Shadows cover him almost entirely

    CAPTION [A]: That kid doesn’t add up.

    Page 5
    [1]
    Normal panel. Close up of the Atoms face as he looks behind him, multiple sirens are far away and getting closer.
    [2]
    Normal panel. We are behind the chain link fence again, the Atom is in the process of jumping over it. The sirens are louder.
    [3]
    Normal panel. The sirens are incredibly close as the Atom ducks behind the trash cans.
    [4]
    Normal panel. The ambulances go past as the Atom is barely visible in the shadows.
    [5]
    Wide panel. We are behind the ambulances now, one of them hits a puddle and the water sprays onto the sidewalk. In the closest one we see part of someone’s face as he talks to another, both of these are distorted by the window tint.
    [6]
    Wide panel. We get closer to this ambulance, the distorted faces are more normal but still twisted by the tinted windows.

    Page 6
    [1]
    Wide panel. We are right next to the windows, a body bag ,blocked by the area between the windows, lies between two figures who are framed by the rubber, the sheriff old and wrinkled with a thick mustache, pair of aviators over his eyes, and Dante Miller, Dante is wear a green jacket over a loose white buttoned shirt, a pair of bifocal glasses on the edge of his nose, lies the body bag. His face is pale and calm with short brown hair, the sheriff is reddish, bald with blond hair where it grows.
    SHERIFF: Detective.

    DANTE: Sheriff.
    [2]
    Normal panel. Sheriffs side of the Ambulance, the body bag in the lower right corner of the vehicle. His eyes are peaking from behind the aviators. His head is leaned forward as well as his shoulders, key is intimidation here.

    SHERIFF: You really shouldn’t be here.

    [3]
    Normal panel. Dante‘s side of the ambulance. The body bag now in the lower left. His hand is adjusting his glasses back to the bridge of his nose. Other hand putting a cigarette in his mouth. His back completely straight.

    DANTE: Neither should that kid.

    [4]
    Normal panel. We go back to the sheriff’s side. His eyes now behind his aviators. His skin is less red now but still angered. His back straight with arms crossed on his lap

    SHERIFF: Don’t get smart with me, greenhorn.

    [5]
    Normal panel. Back to Dante’s side of the ambulance, his face still calm and pale. He is lighting the cigarette.

    DANTE: Heh. I haven’t been a greenhorn for five years, you know that James.

    Page 7
    [1]
    Wide panel. Entire ambulance is shown. They are both in similar positions of sitting.

    SHERIFF: I just miss the old days, that’s all. And none of this gets to the press, understood. And you really shouldn’t smoke in an ambulance.

    DANTE: Who’s gonna care, not Cadaver McCorpseson over here. Anyway, we’re here.

    [2]
    Wide panel. We see both the sheriff and Dante outside the ambulance holding the doors open as the stretcher and body bag is rushed pushed out.
    [3]
    Wide panel. We see the police morgue building. Dante and the sheriff are small silhouettes next to the building. They are following the stretcher as it go to the building
    [4]
    Wide panel. They are walking into the examination room. Dante is dropping the cigarette onto the floor.

    SHERIFF: Pick that up.
    Page 8

    [1]
    Wide panel. Dante is shutting the door behind them. A smirk on his face.

    DANTE: That’s what we pay janitors for James.
    [2]
    Wide panel. We are looking at the body bag. Still zipped and waiting.

    DANTE(OFF PANEL): Open it.

    [3]
    Wide panel. We see the Sheriffs hands as he fumbles with the zipper.

    SHERIFF: Damn things stuck.

    [4]
    Wide panel. The zipper is now working but we cut away before we see the body itself.

    SHERIFF: Here we go…
    Page 9

    [1]
    Normal panel. Dante is standing behind the Sheriff, both shaken, the sheriff biting his lip in a frown, Dante’s eyes wide behind his bifocals.

    DANTE: Damnit…I shouldn’t have dropped that cigarette, I need a smoke to calm the nerves.

    [2]
    Normal panel. Dante has returned to his aloof appearance. His face returned to calm. The sheriff turning away.

    DANTE: Kid was blind

    SHERIFF: God, I need a drink.

    [3]
    Normal panel. We get closer to Dante as he examines the body. His eyes now studying every inch of the body. The sheriff now opening a flask and drinking.

    DANTE: You really shouldn’t drink in a examination room.

    SHERIFF: Shut up.

    [4]
    Normal panel. We are next to Dante’s eye as he looks downwards at the body, it is cold and grayish green.

    DANTE: What did the guy who do this look like James.

    [5]
    Normal panel. We see the bottom of the boy bag, one of the legs is covered while the other is fully revealed, bruised and battered.

    SHERIFF(OFF PANEL): Guy was apparently see-through, Was wearing some kinda jump suit with a radioactive symbol on its chest. Aint that queer?

    DANTE(OFF PANEL): See through with a jumpsuit…Added with those energy blasts…I think this is the Atom we’re dealing with

    [6]
    Normal panel. We are now at the top of the body bag, arm has fallen out of the bag and the body looks like he is about to topple out.

    DANTE(OFF PANEL): He never murders though. Heard he was hiding in Europe as well, lets run a radiation scan to make sure.
    Page 10

    [1]
    Wide panel. The Atom is standing in the middle of an alley in front of the Police morgue, stopping just inside the alley. The alley in question resembles more of a former street, including a street lamp.

    ATOM: Shit…

    [2]
    Wide panel. We are now at the other side of the Atom as he looks at the Building before him.

    ATOM: This isn’t going to be easy.

    [3]
    Wide panel. We watch as the Atom walks towards the courtyard.
    [4]
    Wide panel. We see the atom dodging security as he looks for the examination room.
    Page 11

    [1]
    Wide panel. The atom has stopped right outside the door of the room as Dante and the Sheriff walk out.

    DANTE: Lets get some coffee while that damned thing takes it time, like always, I think this will be a long night.

    [2]
    Wide panel. The atom sneaks into the room after they are gone.
    [3]
    Normal panel. The Atom locks the door behind him while staring at the body.
    [4]
    Normal panel. The Atom has crossed the room and is making the body look more respectable than the previous position did. A beep from the computer shows that the scan is over
    [5]
    Wide panel. The Atom is grabbing the printed radiation scan results as a beat from the door shows that Dante and the Sheriff are back.
    ATOM: Shit.
    Page 12

    [1]
    Normal panel. Dante has successfully kicked the door down.
    [2]
    Normal panel. We see a window in the corner is opened.

    DANTE[OFF PANEL]: Damnit…

    SHERIFF[OFF PANEL]: We need a team in here, culprit has sneaked into the morgue and has escaped.
    [3]
    Normal panel. The Atom is running along the outer wall of the morgue as alarms go off.

    ATOM: Screwed up, must escape. Must prove innocence.

    [4]
    Normal panel. There is a police group around the corner, is pressed against the wall.

    CAPTION [A]: Got to leave before They arrive.

    [5]
    Normal panel. The Atom is running towards the alley he left earlier. The cops notice and are about the open fire.

    CAPTION [A]: They will come from the skies, like they used to.

    [6]
    Normal panel. We are in front of the Atom as about 3 bullets hit him.

    METROPOLITAN: Hold your fire!

    Page 13

    [1]
    Splash page. We are looking up at Metropolitan, who is in a classic silver aged looking outfit, composed of white tights with a red M on it and a red cape, his appearance looks like Christopher Reeves superman but more muscular with white temples, his arms are crossed over his chest.. Also there is the Bearer who is dressed in black tights with sun panels adorning most of him, with wires leading to his ring, he is flying next to the metropolitan. Last of all is Green Streak who is dressed in a green outfit with a green military jacket over it and a pair of streamlined protective glasses, he is the only one on the ground.

    METROPOLITAN: We’ll handle this.
    Page 14

    [1]
    Wide panel. We are on the side of the alley, the atom is heavily bleeding and is holding his wounds, hunched over in pain, he is standing underneath the streetlamp. The heroes are looking down at him, blank expressions on their faces, they are standing outside of the light, they are heavily shadowed.

    ATOM: Always…ones for…a dramatic…appearance.

    [2]
    Normal panel. We are in a close up of the Metropolitans face. A sort of better than though expression on his face.

    METROPOLITAN: Surrender, and we can get you medical help.

    [3]
    Normal panel. We are in a close up of the Atom. His face is determined, looking past the pain. He is on his knee now. He is pulling out the printed papers from earlier, the blood staining it.

    ATOM: Not…Guilty…besides…Lung is collapsing…wont live to surgery…Here…radiation…sca

    [4]
    Wide panel. We are on the side of the alley again. The Atom is dead on the ground, the street lamp has turned off. The heroes have barley moved.
    Page 15

    [1]
    Wide panel. We are behind Dante as he is going through the police in the front of the alley. He is followed by the sheriff.

    DANTE: Great

    [2]
    Wide panel. Dante has entered behind the heroes they turn and acknowledge him.

    DANTE: He’s Dead.

    [3]
    Wide panel. The Heroes are leaving for more urgent matters.

    METROPOLTAN: I apologize, we didn’t know the urgency of his wounds. We must leave now, we leave this in your hands.

    DANTE: Of course…

    [4]
    Wide panel. Dante is standing in front of the corpse holding the bloodstained papers in the meager light. It begins to snow.

    CAPTION [D]: He was innocent, he was framed.
    Page 16

    [1]
    Wide panel. Dante is standing in the snow as the paramedics put the Atoms corpse into a body bag. He and the paramedics along with the street lamp are silhouettes against the whitened background. He is lighting a cigarette.

    CAPTION [D]: I need a smoke.

    [2]
    Wide panel. Dante is standing alone as the body bag is dragged away, the wisps of smoke circling him.

    CAPTION [D]: I can tell this is going to be a long night.

    [3]
    Wide panel. Dante is leaving the scene, the cigarette in his fingers, smoke billowing from his mouth.

    CAPTION [D]: Because if he was framed, that means there must be someone else.

  87. B. Macon 26 Sep 2010 at 9:45 pm

    Last I remember I was laying low in England. Now I’m in America? I wake up in a…parking garage?
    –How does he know he’s in the US? (Maybe someone driving on the right side of the road, instead of the wrong one 😉 ).

    On page 2, he walks away from the scene without doing anything with the kid. He appears to be sort of concerned about the kid later on, so maybe it would make sense if he at least verifies that the kid is dead and/or has any ID on him before walking off.

    I love the detail of him looting a jacket off one of the knocked-down cops. 🙂

    –CAPTION: “I am surrounded by cops upon awaking.” –> I think this is unnecessary, given that we saw the cops right there when he woke up.

    –“I’ve done crimes, but… I left the country two months ago.” Possible alternative: “Why would I have returned? The cops here have been on me for months.” Or “Why would I have come back? I had already gotten away from the police clean. Why risk it?”

    –“SHERIFF: Detective. DANTE: Sheriff.” I think this is much, much better. First, it tells us what kind of person Dante is and something about what he’s doing here. Second, it’s a delightfully awkward/curt exchange, which helps establish the strained relationship between Dante and the sheriff.

    –“Who’s gonna care, not Cadaver McCorpseson over here. Anyway, we’re here.” This was pretty hilarious, especially given that the character looks sort of bookish and nerdy (bifocal glasses on the edge of his nose) and here he is talking like he was born to be brusque and/or badass.

    –There does appear to be some discrepancy between the line “Neither should that kid” and “Who’s gonna care, not Cadaver McCorpseson over here.” The first one might be sort of reverent and compassionate towards the dead kid, the second one much less so. On the other hand, I think this wouldn’t bother me too much from the editor’s desk because, looking back, I don’t think the first one was as reverent as it appeared at first glance.

    –Dante is pretty consistently established as a not very nice person. I could see some people having likability problems with him. Is he a protagonist?

    –What is a blind apparatus? (Those Matrix-style sunglasses that blind people sometimes wear?)

    –The pacing feels much more natural to me.

    –Dante’s personality feels a lot more distinct now. The McCorpseson line is wacky and really stands out.

    –“God, I need a drink.” This is probably not neessary, given that we see him drinking in the next panel.

    –In page 9, panel 3, you have the sheriff drinking and talking at the same time.

    –“See through with a jumpsuit…Added with those energy blasts…I think this is the Atom we’re dealing with.” Based on the pretty precise description they have of the suspect, “I think this is the Atom we’re dealing with” could probably be replaced with something more certain.” Maybe “The Atom,” possibly with a detail adding something we didn’t know about the Atom before. (For example, what crimes is he wanted for?)

    –Dante seems to reach the conclusion pretty suddenly that the Atom was framed. Why? (I think it would take a big leap of intuition to somehow figure out that the guy who attacked the cops isn’t actually guilty of the crime he was being investigated for, particularly if he actually DID commit some crimes to begin with). One possibility: Atom provides some useful/surprising information before he dies, or he surrenders in such a way that it seems like his intent couldn’t be sinister. (Maybe he declines to kill the cops, even though he could, because he knows it wouldn’t make a difference).

    –Metropolitan leaves as soon as the Atom is dead. He doesn’t stick around to ask any questions or look around at anything. I think his sudden departure strikes me as a bit unusual, unless you’re trying to show that his job only consists of combat (a la the Hulk rather than Batman). Maybe the detective could make some sort of remark about the hero flying away as soon as the real work begins… or maybe he guesses that Metro has some sudden emergency on the other side of the world, or something.

  88. Mr. Crowleyon 27 Sep 2010 at 2:28 pm

    I intend for Dante to be a jerk, through out the story he gets more and more into this conspiracy and and gets more and more serious and less sarcastic, the sheer enourmacey of the knowledge basically breaks him.
    By blind apparatus I meant liek a walking stick and, yes, those matrix style sunglasses.
    I seem to forgotten soemething in the Atoms original dialogue, he talks about how these are american police, I think that if american police try to arrest you you will figure out where you are pretty fast.
    the paper dante picks up has the results of the radiation scan, it shows the radiation signature is different from the Atoms.
    I was trying to finish the script and I forgot to add a line where he basically goes
    “let me guess, trouble somewhere not here, pretty convient…”

  89. Mr. Crowleyon 08 Oct 2010 at 11:03 am

    I just sent off my script and a plot summary to dark horse comics. Wish it luck, its might to need it.

  90. B. Macon 08 Oct 2010 at 12:36 pm

    Good luck!

  91. Mr. Crowleyon 15 Nov 2010 at 7:17 pm

    well I didnt get a response so I decided to let my bordom reign over me and rewrote my idea, yet again. I’ll post my idea’s in a second.

  92. Mr. Crowleyon 15 Nov 2010 at 7:21 pm

    The world
    New Asgard is about the size of a small mountain and contains several superheroes who are now named after Greek and Norse gods. There are three factions of this civil war that is going on inside, one controlled by Zeus, who is more technologically inclined and doesn’t want to interfere with the world but wants everyone to worship him. Poseidon, who is less technologically inclined and wants to rule the world. And Odin, who is a anarchist freedom fighter who wants to get rid of both because the people of New Asgard will be oppressed by both. New Asgard is also divided into 3 political factions based on superpowers, the Olympians, the Asgardians, and the worshiper/workers, who have little to no power in the government.
    The world is also divided similarly into people who don’t care about New Asgard, the people who worship them, and the people who hate them. The worshipers are divided into two factions as well. There are the people who worship the Gods on the ground, and the people who travel to New Asgard to worship them. The Earth has superheroes too, in a younger generation of heroes known as the Battalion, who are all around the teenage years of they’re life’s and are led by the Raven, who is rich and houses them in his home and trains them. They’re was an event in the past involving a man known as Darcy Shade, who is a genius, that involved involuntary suicide bombers destroying a large chunk of the Winter Forest, a section of New Asgard.

    The Plot
    Morpheus is found dead and is thought to have been killed by the Atom, who was found beside him. The Atom is later killed after being shot by police attempting to prove his innocence with a radiation scan. Dante Miller does some detective work and learns more on Zeus, including his name and about a mysterious event in New York. We drop in on a New Asgard meeting as Zeus and Poseidon get into a heated debate about the world before adjourning. Poseidon is shown to be a good guy but is slowly revealed to be evil, while Zeus Is shown as a little more human then he allows people to know. Odin is shown being contacted by some mysterious person known as the Shadow man. Around then Hermes is killed while meeting someone on Earth. This leads to mass media attention and some skirmishes between the Followers and the Haters. Dante meets with Darcy and they talk about the murders, but Darcy keeps taunting Dante with information on the New York event. Dante leaves as he is annoyed and is frankly creeped out by Darcy. He follows some leads on the murder, involving meeting the Battalion and the Raven, and is soon invited to New Asgard, because Zeus finds his investigation interesting. He arrives and they dine when Zeus reveals that he brought him to talk about the New York event, not the murder. He shows him the power source of the entire city, Thor’s formerly mythological hammer. He tells him about how he killed Thor and the rest of the Norse gods and took it. Dante leaves, disgusted, before Poseidon is found dead and New Asgard is shut down so no one can leave. Dante tracks down Odin and asks him his opinion of things here, and Odin talks about how he wishes to help the people, but Dante believes he might know something about the murders. It is learned that it was Helios who killed Poseidon because he wishes to take his place. Helios is killed and Dante is allowed to leave, where he learns that there has been war on the streets between the believers and non-believers. He also learns that Darcy died and goes to see his cell, where he finds a note that condemns the Raven as the killer. He contacts Zeus and goes to confront him. Here Raven proposes an ultimatum, either they all die here and let everything go back to the way things were, or the world will be destroyed by the Superheroes sooner or later. So they decide it be best to die, except Dante

  93. Mr. Crowleyon 15 Nov 2010 at 7:24 pm

    As you can see, it involves a more literal concept of physical gods, also it allows me a side plot and it isnt full of expies, my madness for them has subsided a bit. And because he is standing right next to me and looks like he may hurt me if I dont give him some credit, my brother helped me come up with some of the ideas for New Asgard’s structure.

  94. B. Macon 16 Nov 2010 at 12:01 am

    Oof, I’m sorry I didn’t respond before. Okay, I have some thoughts and suggestions.

    When you pitch this to publishers, I’d recommend taking out some of the factions from the synopsis. For example, unless it’s really important to know that there’s a division between the people that worship the Gods on the ground and those that go to New Asgard, I think that telling us about the division might make the political situation a bit harder to follow.

    It feels to me like there’s a disconnect between the inciting event (the deaths of Morpheus and the Atom) and the quasi-mythological premise about the gods/superheroes named after gods and New Asgard. It might help if the character that got murdered WAS one of the gods. For example, maybe you could move up Poseidon’s death as the inciting event.

    In the proposal to the publisher, I’d recommend making the main character(s) more prominent. Right now, no one in the first half gets more than a sentence.

    When you introduce an important character, I’d recommend throwing in a brief description of what he does or something important we need to know about the character to understand his role in the plot. For example, “Morpheus is found dead”—who is Morpheus? It might help to say something like “Morpheus, a [interesting modifier] superhero is found dead, thought to have been killed by one of his teammates [I made that up], the Atom.”

    I sort of get the impression that Morpheus and the Atom are more plot devices than characters. That’s not a problem, but I would not give them as much description in the synopsis as for characters like Dante Miller that affect the plot more, get more screentime in the story, etc. Assuming that’s the case, I’d recommend rephrasing the first three sentences so that it’s clear that Dante is someone that’s a main player and not just one of the guys that gets killed. I’ve made up some details, but I’d recommend something like this:

    “After a beloved superhero is found brutally murdered, his teammate gets killed by the police before he can prove his innocence. Ace detective Dante Miller tries to solve the case, only to find [complication/interesting problem–maybe something related to the Asgard intrigue].”

    Let me know if you have any other questions! 🙂

    –BM

  95. Mr. Crowleyon 16 Nov 2010 at 3:49 pm

    I was trying to keep most of the plot the smae, now I see some things that dont match, thanks for showing me. Heres a plot summary of Issue one.

    There are two men sitting on a bench reading newspaper, (Im intending to have these two guys recap things and help explain the laymans view here, like that kid and man in Watchmen) they notice a giant shadow and one comments on how its monday and they go back to reading. We see New Asgard on the horizon blocking out the sun. We close in and hear a debate over levels of technology between Poseidon and Zeus. Poseidon is shown as being charismatic and charming while Zeus is shown as old and tired (similar to the televised debate between JFK and Richard Nixon). Court is adjorned and everyone leaves. Zeus goes to the newly rebuilt Winter Forest and is shown as being alot more human then on first glance, though a bit egotistical, Poseidon is shown as being evil than he appears, and also being a Meglomaniac. He goes through the slums and is shot through the spine. We go to Dante as he goes across police tape to see the body, which is now on the ground. He gets less restrictions on his abilities in this investigating, meaning he can research into government files formerly restricted to the police and public. He investigates the body for a bit before handing it over to some Centurions (which are the equivalent of police and paramedics on New Asgard). Dante goes of to look into the Government files on the Gods and finds a file on a new york event, with little information in it. He gets interested but decides not to get destracted too much by it. He goes home no foot and passes the Two men with newspapers as they get up and leave. He apparently knows them and asks if anything is happening. They tell him about someone named Odin who is fighting for equal rights on New Asgard. Dane pays it no mind and decides to talk to a prisoner named Darcy Shade, who has been on and destroyed some of higher New Asgard, which no “normal” as we are called is allowed on.

  96. Mr. Crowleyon 20 Nov 2010 at 8:22 am

    Well Ive finished eight pages of the first issue, but I think that newar the end I geot a bit melo dramatic with the dialogue. Ill post it next.

  97. Mr. Crowleyon 20 Nov 2010 at 8:24 am

    PAGE ONE (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal Panel. Frontal view of two men sitting on a bench, both with newspapers covering they’re faces, the headline is ‘New Asgard Debate Today’. The MAN ON THE LEFT is wearing blue jeans and sneakers and the MAN ON THE RIGHT is wearing brown slacks and dress shoes. The bench is old and worn in, of a purple color. Behind them a man in a jogging outfit of black shorts and a blue sleeveless shirt runs past, from the right to the left of the panel, a Mp3 clipped to his waist with a earplug in both ears, he is somewhat thin but not really buff either. Two small oak trees flank the bench and the sidewalk is weather stained with a sewer grating next to the foot of the MAN ON THE LEFT. Behind them is a shop with a tinted window with 3 TV’s made of only flat panels of glass on a black stand all on mute, one plays football, with one player jumping to catch a ball and another player about to tackle him, one plays golf, with a ball going into the 12th hole with the cabby holding up the flag, while the last plays a game show, with a man in a suit smiling at a contestant with $1000 written on a screen on her stand, at the bottom of the window there is a sign that says ‘Half Off All TV‘s! Just Imported From New Asgard!‘, the building is made red and old, a door near the window says open in big red letters on a black background and is hung from a plastic hook on the inside of the door.

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    Going to be one of those days ain’t it?

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Yeah.

    Panel 2. Normal Panel. Same scene except that a shadow is appearing next to the MAN THE ON RIGHT’s foot and the jogger has passed. The TV’s show the football player being tackled to the ground, the golf ball having made the hole, and a close up of the suited man with his arm around the contestants shoulder, pointing off screen to someone and talking.

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    So, how’s the wife and kids.

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    They’re good, how’s the new girlfriend

    (more)

    PAGE ONE, CONTINUED

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    She’s really doing good, you know? Just got hired at the old library on Brittle.

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Well, good for her, after what she’s been through, with unemployment and all.

    Panel 3. Normal Panel. Same scene except now the shadow has grown bigger, covering most of the MAN ON THE RIGHT’s body, but he doesn’t notice, and now his right leg is atop his left. A big man is behind the door and flipping the sign around. The TV’s show a football score bored, a Golfer hitting a ball up into the air, gulf club being held left handed, and a word board being filled in with the letters ‘N– A-G–D’ and a woman in a long dress holding her hands next to it. A teenager walks in from the left side of the panel wearing a black t shirt that says ‘Who needs superpowers when you have a GRENADE!?’, hands in his pockets and black hair in face, sneakers on his feet.

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    So, what do you think about the debates?

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Well, it doesn’t really concern me what Poseidon and Zeus do, you know?

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    How do you mean?

    Panel 4. Normal panel. Same scene except that now the shadow is now covering most of MAN ON THE LEFT’s body. The door sign now says closed and the TV’s show the football players in formation on the 10” mark, a gulf ball coming back to earth near a very old tree, and a close up of the contestant’s face as she thinks hard. The teenager is walking out to the scene to the right side of the panel.

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Well, the decisions made on New Asgard are important to most of the people on Earth, right?

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    Yes, people take them very seriously

    Panel 5. Normal Panel. Same scene except that now the Shadow is covering the entire street. The TV’s showing the football players running into one another, a close up of the ball as it bounces off the ground, And the contestant with a smile on her face and her hand next to her face pointing upwards

    (more)
    PAGE ONE, CONTINUED

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Well, I just figure my life isn’t very affected by they’re decisions personally, so really I don’t think to care about them that much.

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    Personal philosophy of yours?

    MAN ON THE RIGHT:
    Yes, actually it is.

    Panel 6. Normal panel. The scene has shifted to over the left side of the men on the bench as they look up in disinterest, MAN ON THE RIGHT’s newspaper has bent over. MAN ON THE LEFT is very pale skinned with dark hair and a white t-shirt on, a long slender nose dominates his face. MAN ON THE RIGHT is somewhat plump, but still thinned faced tanned skin, a pair of wire frames on his face with a roman nose and thin eyebrows.

    MAN ON THE LEFT:
    Oh, forgot it was that time of the month.

    PAGE TWO (1 panel)

    Panel 1. Splash panel. Worm’s eye view of a large structure, the bottom is shaped like a pendulum and is made of golden colored metal. On top is a large structure other shaped like a Art Deco Tower of Babel, made of white stone. There are some structures that surround it that are almost unnoticeable and are shaped like huts, with some largish trees circling the Tower to hide them and to add to the aesthetic appeal of this near perfect building. In the background are some large stratocumulus clouds behind it, but none obscuring the sun, which shines off of the structure. An eagles fly below it.

    PAGE THREE (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. We are close up the eagles wings. It has turned and is returning into a window on the side of the tower. The window is flat bottomed and rounded at the top, nothing but blackness inside.

    POSEIDON (inside window):
    We need to increase New Asgard’s science budgets to help the worshipers with they’re work here.

    Panel 2. Normal panel. We close in on the window, its blackness nearly taking up all of the panel.

    ZEUS (inside window):
    And I say we don’t. If we allow science to run wild then nothing will be accomplished considering that no one will go to work.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. Side view a room with two rings of seats, one on top of the other. Above those and across from each other are thrones, while the one on the right is higher than the one on the left. The one on the left is made of dark marble with two waterfalls flanking it on either side, here site Poseidon who is dressed in Greek military style gear. He is slightly out of his seat, hand pointing at the other side of the room. On the other side of the room is a throne made of white plaster with a seat for the eagle, who is just now landing on it, is close to the throne. Zeus sits in this one and he wears a red cape, pinned to him like a toga with a gold button, over his old superhero tights and boots. Below the rings of seats is a standing area for the 15 reporters in there, ten with video cameras, five with regular picture cameras.

    POSEIDON:
    So you admit that you do not wish for your subjects to be happy.

    Panel 4. Normal panel. Close up at ZEUS’s face. He has bags under his eyes and his beard is unkempt. Long grey streaks in his dark brown hair and wrinkles on his olive toned face. But his eyes shine bright and fierce and his face is serious.

    ZEUS:
    That is not what I meant.

    Panel 5. Normal panel. Close up of POSEIDON’s face. He looks like a very young and energetic Brian Blessed, including beard.

    POSEIDON:
    No I think that’s exactly what you meant.

    (more)
    PAGE THREE, CONTINUED

    Panel 6. Partial side view of ZEUS as he looks away, shadows masking his face. His knuckles white from clutching the arm rests too hard.

    ZEUS:
    Court Adjourned.

    PAGE FOUR (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. Worms eye view as ZEUS fly’s out of his chair, his toga flowing around him, hands clutched behind his back and looking downwards.

    Panel 2. Normal panel. Frontal view as POSEIDON as he fly’s out of his chair as well, but less dominate looking and more comforting.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. Over-behind view POSEIDON’s as he fly’s through New Asgard. Two people look up at him, one has stopped polishing the steps to the tower and pushes the rags of his hood out of his face and is smiling at POSEIDON, the other is African American and has stopped from his sweeping and is grinning at him.

    Panel 4. Normal panel. POSEIDON is landing in front of a run down looking hut with its front door open and is greeted by a thick lipped balding man in a jacket and slacks named BOB, who is standing on the front porch. The area is shadowed by a very large tree. The man has his hand outstretched to shake POSEIDON’s.

    BOB:
    Hello sir, very nice to see you back from the debate.

    Panel 5. Normal panel. View from inside the house out, POSEIDON walks past BOB who is pulling his hand up in an act of saving face.

    POSEIDON:
    Idiotic fool, Zeus is. He keeps trying to beat me in these debates, no matter how many times he loses.

    Panel 6. View of BOB as he turns to go in himself, a look of worry on his face.

    BOB (small):
    Well sir, I think it is somewhat…commendable…that he try’s to beat you to the very end.

    PAGE FIVE (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. Over BOB’s shoulder view as POSEIDON has turned around, a look of both anger and confusion on his face.

    POSEIDON (burst):
    Commendable!?

    BOB (small);
    Yes…sir…

    Panel 2. Normal panel. Close up of POSEIDON’s face as he ponders this, hand clutching his chin.

    POSEIDON:
    Yes, commendable…well then.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. POSEIDON has his arms stretched in front of him like he is trying to envision a scene better. BOB is behind him, nervous and trying not to be noticed too much, hand drawn to his mouth as he bites his nails

    POSEIDON:
    Yes, that’s what his plaque will say!

    BOB:
    Plaque, sir?

    POSEIDON:
    Yes, it will say “he was a very commendable opponent, but in the end he was defeated by our great leader Poseidon, the great!” it will be glorious.

    Panel 4. Normal panel. POSEIDON is walking back through the door, looking back over his shoulder at BOB.

    POSEIDON:
    Well, thanks for that Bob, I just came to tell you to cancel my appointments tomorrow, Aphrodite is coming over and, well, you know how she’s like. Doesn’t even want you to leave the room until she needs a wheel chair to exit.

    Panel 5. Normal panel. Close up of BOB’s face.

    BOB (weak):
    Yes sir…

    (more)
    PAGE FIVE, CONTINUED

    Panel 6. Normal panel. BOB is seated at a destroyed table his head in his hands. His body and face being heavily shadowed.

    BOB (weak):
    …Of course sir

    PAGE SIX (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. Frontal view of ZEUS as he walks through a doorway, arms behind his back, his face more haggard then before.

    Panel 2. Normal panel. Behind view of ZEUS and we see a pale freckled woman crouching sideways to us and taking care of some white roses. She is dressed in white bell bottoms and tank top, her dark red hair in a ponytail, her name is DEMETER. Behind her is a huge forest of pines, all of them coated in snow, several shadows far into the background

    DEMETER:
    Well Zeus, how did the debate go? I would have watched but my roses needed tending to.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. Close up of ZEUS’s face as he looks away.

    ZEUS:
    Not well, my love. Poseidon defeats me at every turn, the people are firmly on his side.

    Panel 4. Normal panel. Close up of ZEUS’s face as he looks up at his surroundings, a smile on his face, this is the first time in which he doesn’t look tired.

    ZEUS:
    But all of that doesn’t matter here, in our Winter Forest. The repairs have finally been finished.

    Panel 5. Normal panel. DEMETER is walking towards ZEUS, a pout on her mouth.

    DEMETER:
    Yes, Mr. Shade put a big dent here, but it doesn’t matter now.

    Panel 6. Normal panel. DEMETER is in front of ZEUS, her hand on his lips, her face drawn up close to his, he is a good 3 inches taller than her.

    DEMETER:
    For we are together.

    PAGE SEVEN (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. A CENTURION, dressed in roman styled armor but with some technological advancements in the shoulder and arm areas to increase strength, and a visor over the eyes, walks into the Winter Forest door.

    CENTURION:
    Sir. I apologize for interrupting but something has happened that you need to know.

    Panel 2. Normal panel. ZEUS has turned towards the CENTURION, his face has lost its life and now looks old and tired yet again, he holds DEMETER’s wrist in his left hand.

    ZEUS:
    What is it.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. Close up of the CENTURION’s face, a weakness is visible.

    CENTURION:
    Well sir, it deals with Poseidon.

    Panel 4. Normal panel. Close up of ZEUS’s face, a mixture of boredom and anger on his face.

    ZEUS:
    What could he want? He has embarrassed me enough for one day.

    Panel 5. Normal panel. Close up of the CENTURION’s face.

    CENTURION:
    He’s dead sir, just found him five minutes ago.

    Panel 6. Normal panel. Zeus has turned to DEMETER and shares a scared look with her. His face has gone pale along with her hand which is now a paper white, while his hand has veins sticking out of it.

    ZEUS:
    Leave

    CENTURION:
    Yes sir!

    PAGE EIGHT (6 panels)

    Panel 1. Normal panel. Worms eye view as DANTE is leaning over something and looking down at us. He has bifocal glasses on and short brown hair. He is wearing a blue collard shirt, over which is a green/brown jacket which is several sizes too big, and a loose red tie which hangs towards us.

    DANTE:
    Well–

    Panel 2. Normal panel. Bird eye as we see DANTE is looking over a crater with POSEIDON’s body in it, completely unrecognizable except for his armor. Around this crater, but far away from DANTE and the policemen behind him are CENTURIONS\, except there is one CENTURION arguing with a POLICE SHERIFF

    DANTE:
    –Looks like invulnerability wasn’t one of his powers.

    Panel 3. Normal panel. Behind view of Dante as he walks towards the two arguing men. The POLICE SHERIFF is red faced with a thick yellow mustache and a pair of aviators, the CENTURION is African American and annoyed

    CENTURION:
    –He is a New Asgardian, his death is our investigation.

    POLICE SHERIFF:
    But he is on US soil, which means that he is our investigation.

    DANTE:
    Well what’s all this then…always wanted to say that.

    Panel 4. Close up of the POLICE SHERIFF’s face.

    POLICE SHERIFF:
    This man is trying to take on police matters.

    Panel 5. Close up of the CENTURION’s face.

    CENTURION:
    Well this man is trying to take away official matters of New Asgard.

    Panel 6. Close up of DANTE’s face, which now has a huge smirk on it.
    (more)

    PAGE EIGHT, CONTINUED

    DANTE:
    Well I’ve got the solution, just give me the case.

  98. Mr. Crowleyon 20 Nov 2010 at 8:26 am

    And yes, its long. Also where it says More and page continued, its that Dark Horse requires people to do one page of script on one page of paper, and if you need more room you have to put that and start the next page on the next sheet of paper.

  99. Fatal Creedon 20 Nov 2010 at 5:26 pm

    Winter forest huh? Wonder where you got that name from.

  100. Fatal Creedon 20 Nov 2010 at 5:29 pm

    So where’s Odin. You haven’t mentioned him yet.

  101. Fatal Creedon 20 Nov 2010 at 5:58 pm

    Oh never mind about Odin, I only read the script above and just now read the whole page…yeah…
    But I guess I should start giving constructive criticism or they’ll like kick me off the site or something. I like the story so far, and I say so far because naturally your going to change a few things. But could you give the characters some more room to talk.

  102. Fatal Creedon 20 Nov 2010 at 7:28 pm

    Dude, you should totally make Zeus look like Zakk Wylde.

    It would be epic.

  103. B. Macon 20 Nov 2010 at 10:18 pm

    (Reading the six pages)…

  104. B. Macon 20 Nov 2010 at 11:59 pm

    –Page 1, panel 1 (1-1): I’m having trouble visualizing how a medium-sized panel 1 could fit all of this. In the foreground, we have two guys from the waist down and their newspapers. Elsewhere, we have a somewhat detailed jogger, a sewer grate, a shop with three TVs, two bubbles of dialogue, a shop in the background, and a sign.

    –I like the details bringing Asgard into “our” world, like the newspaper headline and the sign about the imported TVs.

    –In the second panel, the dialogue strikes me as a bit bland. I get the impression that we’re mainly passing time while something is about to happen, which is fine, but I think it’d help if we at least got the momentary impression like this conversation is what we’re supposed to be reading right now. More style might help.

    –I think spacing will be an issue on this page. I’d recommend getting out a pencil and seeing if you’ll have enough space on a page to get in everything you’re trying to do.

    –I would recommend describing the two men by their clothes rather than where they’re sitting–something like CASUAL-DRESSED MAN and BUSINESSMAN.

    –I’m sort of having trouble visualizing how the teen would come walking from the left in such a way that we’d be able to read his t-shirt. If he’s walking in from the left, we’d see his side, right? (It’s a funny shirt, though).

    –I think “what do you think about the debates?”/”it doesn’t really concern me what Poseidon and Zeus do, you know?” are okay, but I feel that the conversation generally could be more stylish. For example, maybe instead of “it doesn’t really concern me what Poseidon and Zeus do, you know?”, maybe something like “What do I care? I don’t watch presidential debates, either.”

    –“Personal philosophy of yours?”/”Yes, actually it is” could probably be removed, I think.

    –“they’re decisions” should be “their decisions.” Their is the possessive; they’re is the contraction for they are. Also, “they’re work” -> “their work”

    –It might help to suggest what Zeus and Poseidon are debating about.

    –When he says “that time of the month,” what’s he talking about?

    –“And I say we don’t. If we allow science to run wild then nothing will be accomplished considering that no one will go to work.” I think “And I say we don’t” can be removed because it’s clear that Zeus’ position is opposed to Poseidon’s.

    –In 3-3, it might help to give your artist a better idea of the impression you’re going for. Does this look more like a modern auditorium with thrones in the middle or more like a classic-style Roman forum?

    –I don’t think “No, I think that’s exactly what you meant” is as witty a retort to “That is not what I meant” as it could be.

    –I really like the visual details in 3-6, showing how Zeus is getting strained (especially in contrast to the younger-looking and more vibrant Poseidon).

    –Minor tense note: apostrophes are not usually used in tenses except as a contraction. “Zeus fly’s” –> “Zeus flies” and “he try’s” –> “he tries”

    –“it will say “he was a very commendable opponent, but in the end he was defeated by our great leader Poseidon, the great!” it will be glorious.” Hehe, I like this a lot. “It will be glorious,” indeed. 🙂

    –“Cancel my appointments tomorrow, Aphrodite is coming over and, well, you know how she’s like. Doesn’t even want you to leave the room until she needs a wheel chair to exit.” Ooh, wow, that’s dirty. It really stands out in a stylish sort of way. Do you think you can try making the language in the first page that distinctive?

    –“Sir. I apologize for interrupting but something has happened that you need to know”/”What is it”/”Well, sir, it deals with Poseidon.” I think this could be shortened and maybe accentuated a bit. Maybe the guard comes in, clearly out of breath like he’s run HARD to bring this shocking news, and he starts with “Grave news, sir!” / “Yes?” / “Poseidon…” (he’s thinking about how to phrase this carefully) / “What could he want? To embarrass me again?” / “He’s dead, sir.”

    –I would recommend checking out all the sentences that begin with an empty interjector like Well or So. In most cases, they can be removed.

  105. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Nov 2010 at 8:42 am

    Wow Thanks for pointing out all of the dialogue mistakes. alright now to justify a few things. First the scene with “I forgot it was that time of the month.” he is mentioning that he forgot that this was the day of the month that New Asgard passes over america, thats what the shadow creeping along that they didnt pay attention to was.

    Mainly during the first page I was just trying to figure out movements and placement.

    I know the teenager’s shirt wouldnt be able to show all of its message, its just that I wanted the artist to know what the message was so that he would know what It was.

    I really didnt realize how dirty that dialogue was, I was around 10 at night when I wrote the last few pages. Do you think I should remove it.

    Thanks for the suggestion about the guards dialogue, Ill add it in later.

    The GIANT amount of detail about the background was really just my attempt to control everything, I dropped it later though, Is there anything in that scene you think could or should be removed?

  106. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Nov 2010 at 8:45 am

    Okay I just realized how confuding my shirt detail justification was, let me try this again. The shirt’s message wont all be shown, I know that, its just that I want the artist to know how long the message is show he/she can space the words properly as if the entire message was theyre, because if I put parts of the message it might be a little confusing on what exactly the shirt says if he/she gets it wrong. If this is also confusing at least it all made sense in my mind.

  107. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Nov 2010 at 9:10 am

    Many typos in my last message, I just cant win.

  108. B. Macon 21 Nov 2010 at 2:11 pm

    “I really didn’t realize how dirty that dialogue was… Do you think I should remove it?” It depends on your target audience. If you’re looking at readers younger than 18, I think it’s too risque. If you’re looking at older readers, I think it’s effective characterization (showing that Poseidon is a total douche) and is funny. So far, it’s the most memorable line.

    I don’t feel like you’re overmanaging the scene (i.e. stepping too far into the artist’s turf). My main concern is that the script is asking for more objects than I think this panel can fit. Talk with your artist to see what is possible, but my back-of-the-envelope guesstimate is that the material in the first panel would take somewhere between a quarter and a third of the page to fit comfortably. If the artist reports that he doesn’t have space to do it all, I think that the TV shop can be removed pretty easily.

  109. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Nov 2010 at 2:21 pm

    Well, I was trying to make Poseidon seem less of the ideal person his opening speech made him seem. I intend that throughout the story Poseidon’s treachery is shown alot more while Zeus is shown as being more human if out of touch with the world around him.

  110. Mr. Crowleyon 21 Nov 2010 at 2:23 pm

    ANd also Im trying to see If I can write something for a more mature audience.

  111. Mr. Crowleyon 22 Nov 2010 at 2:55 pm

    Hey, I had an idea about the issue when Dante visits Darcy (the prisoner) that he has to pass alot of mentaly disturbed inmates. It came to me because I was thinking how it would be awsome and/or disturbing for them to be singing random bits of old superhero cartoons. List so far is Freakazoid!, The Mask, Darkwing Duck, Beetlejuice, Animaniacs, and Pinky and the Brain. Also I thought that since Im already changing some plot points, I want Darcy to escape near the end, when a group of guards come to take him to be executed, with the song ‘I’ve got a lovely bunch of coconuts’ being played in the background. Do you think it’d be legal to do this.

    Also Im stuck on how to get Dante the job without a Deus Ex Machina, because I cant think of how else I can considering his situation.

  112. B. Macon 22 Nov 2010 at 9:26 pm

    It seems like your story has a delightfully tricky impasse between the local (U.S.?) government and the Asgardians. Obviously, both parties have an interest in controlling the investigation of the death of an Asgardian leader on U.S. soil.

    Here are some compromises that might lead to Dante getting involved:

    1) To allay Asgardian concerns, the police bring Dante on board as an independent observer to make sure the investigation is run professionally. For this to work, Dante needs to be already-known to the Asgardians, perhaps because he’s worked cases for them (or somehow related to them) before.

    2) The police box out the Asgardians and refuse to let any of them investigate the case. (This strikes me as plausible, particularly if Asgard-US relations are less-than-friendly). The Asgardians can’t investigate the case on their own, so they turn to Dante. Unlike the previous option, Dante would probably be a private investigator and not a detective with any actual police authority.

    3) Dante decides to work the case on his own (perhaps to build a reputation or because he has some personal connection) and the local police have boxed out the Asgardians. He may end up conflicting with the police and/or the Asgardians before it’s all over. Unlike the two previous options, Dante does not need to be an experienced and respected investigator.

    4) Dante is actually an employee of the Asgardian government (perhaps undercover, perhaps not).



    I don’t know if it’d be legal to use the old superhero cartoons, but more importantly, I’m not sure if it’d be helpful to bring in cartoons that don’t have an apparent connection to the story you’re writing. (For example, what would Animaniacs, Pinky and the Brain, or Beetlejuice add to your story?) If you were writing a parody of 1990s cartoons, then I think the connection would be really clear. (For example, one of my main protagonists is a play on the 1990s mutant animal fad, so I think there might be some pointed references to Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles or Battle Toads, etc.

  113. Mr. Crowleyon 23 Nov 2010 at 3:04 pm

    It was really just a random idea I had and wanted to see if it was any good, it really didnt have any connection I just wanted people to sing distorted Freakazoid lyrics…

    ANYWAY, I had an idea a while ago and it basically revolves around Dante black mailing both of them into letting him do this. But I like the idea of Dante being hired by the New Asgardians because I think that sounds like something he would do, just doing this because of money and personal boredom.

    Also I know how to end the story (hurray!!) Darcy has been manipulating events and leaves the prison (mentioned his escape in a earlier post) to finish the job and gets to New Asgard. He kills Zeus from behind, there is no “I only did this to help the world” he just wanted revenge for his imprisonment (to which Dante retorts “Dude, you blew up part of his city”). Dante handcuffs the overtly smug Darcy, who thinks that with all of the confusing contredictions, most likely he will get away with it. Dante agrees as he brings him to the teleporters then tells him that’s why he isnt going to bring him to the authorities and proceeds to put his boot on Darcy’s back and kick him over the side (Remember, at this point Dante is heavily cynical and uncaring, and possibly insane). We go forward a bit and see Dante in a prison jumper talking to some high ranking official before being let go “temporarily”

    The only problem I see in this ending is the part where Dante is telling the high ranking official, considering that the narrative goes to several different people, but overall I think that this is going to be what I go with.

  114. B. Macon 23 Nov 2010 at 6:14 pm

    “Dante black mailing both of them into letting him do this…” If he does so, I think that he needs a strong motivation to get involved. Using blackmail to get onto a case could not be justified with just curiosity. 🙂

    “Darcy, who thinks that with all of the confusing contradictions, he will get away with it…” Which confusing contradictions?

    So, just to clarify, Dante kicks Darcy over the side, where he falls to his death? Or does he kick Darcy over the side into the teleporter?

    “We see Dante in a prison jumper talking to some high-ranking official before being let go ‘temporarily.'” I’m not sure I understand the implication here. Is the official letting Dante escape? Why? (Animosity towards the Asgardians is a possible motive).

  115. Mr. Crowleyon 23 Nov 2010 at 6:31 pm

    Well, I decided to go with the idea that New Asgard hires him to investigate because they couldnt.

    Well, there is the fact that he only killed one guy, and no one saw him do that. Also there is that they dont know who killed Poseidon, because the guy who did that was killed in Darcy’s escape (he was his guard, who he manipulated). Then theyre is the fact that Darcy was promised bail (and a record player, thats how he plays the song during his escape, just some trivia) if his information leads to the capture of the culprit, and considering that it just led back to him that means that even if he was accused then he cant be sent to prison because his information helped in the case and he still has enough contacts and legally gained money to pay his way out.

    Yes, Dante kicks Darcy over the edge to his death.

    The temporarily part was just that they can and will kill him if he becomes a threat, considering how much he knows about the government and New Asgard after this ordeal.

  116. B. Macon 23 Nov 2010 at 6:43 pm

    It may help to come up with a reason that the government doesn’t just kill Dante if they’re so afraid of him that they’re unwilling to put him in prison. For example, maybe Dante has a friend somewhere (like a journalist) who has been ordered to publish EVERYTHING if Dante dies under mysterious circumstances or rots in jail.

    It’s more believable than the end of Watchmen, in any case.

  117. Mr. Crowleyon 24 Nov 2010 at 8:02 am

    How about he has a pace maker that if it is removed or he is killed than it releases the information to the internet and every single journalistic group in the world. Its not the most unbelievable thing to grace comics.

    And how do you mean more believable than the end of Watchmen? You mean the part where the Americans and the Russians team up because of the alien thing?

  118. B. Macon 24 Nov 2010 at 10:50 am

    The part where the protagonists let Ozymandias go for no sane reason. (They accept Ozymandias’ delusion that killing him would result in nuclear war, but I can’t think of any way that it would).

  119. Sean Higginson 24 Nov 2010 at 11:16 am

    The world in Watchmen is already on it’s way to a nuclear war to end all wars. Doctor Manhattan who has incredible clarity reasons that, seeing as Ozymandias has already completed his plan, killing him would only ruin the peace that would follow. It wasn’t just the killing though, because they were heroes, they couldn’t (or wouldn’t) kill him without revealing what had taken place. Revealing the plan would cause the entire world to continue down it’s self destructive path.

    I’m sure if Doctor Manhattan had arrived before the explosions, Ozymandias would have been nothing but vapor.

  120. B. Macon 24 Nov 2010 at 6:36 pm

    “They couldn’t (or wouldn’t) kill him without revealing what had taken place.” How would killing him reveal what had taken place? They could just chalk it up to the (fake) murderer that tried to kill Ozymandias before, or even pin it on Rorschach or Manhattan.

  121. Mr. Crowleyon 25 Nov 2010 at 7:26 am

    I dont think they ever had the intention of killing him, Im pretty sure they were just going to stop him from going through with his plan, but he ‘Already activated it 35 minutes ago’. And then the plan worked and they just couldnt reveal him to the world because the peace would be broken and the tensions would escalate into nuclear war. They might be deconstructed but they are still super heroes, they dont kill. Except Rorsach, but that was two times and both were child molesters (I think) and one killed the child and fed her to his dogs, and he went insane, but he knew that he couldnt kill Ozymandias (because the guys physically perfect, or something) but he could reveal his conspiracy to the world.So no one had the intention of killing him, except Sally with the gun, but even that didnt work, at point blank.

  122. B. Macon 25 Nov 2010 at 12:57 pm

    “They might be deconstructed but they are still super heroes, they dont kill. ” Umm, they DID kill Rorschach.

  123. Mr. Crowleyon 25 Nov 2010 at 2:25 pm

    The others didnt know that was going to happen, and killing Rorschach and stopping him from reaching society to reveal ozymandias would ensure peace for a while (because its heavily implied that it wont work forever). He and Adrian only see’s the big picture, not the small details like one more human life to save millions.

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