Comments on: 5 Common Mistakes for First-Time Novelists http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/ Writing advice for superhero, fantasy & sci-fi authors Mon, 15 Mar 2010 05:58:08 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: B. Mac http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-36428 B. Mac Mon, 20 Jul 2009 16:09:32 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-36428 Who's your target audience? I think Spook could work as a name, but I suspect it might have issues appealing to readers older than (say) 13. If your audience is older than that, I'd recommend something a bit more serious. Or spooky! :) If your target audience is younger, then I think Spook is fine. <br /> How many more powers are there? I'd recommend keeping the amount limited... that will help you cut down on how much time you need to explain them. It'll also help the readers remember them. <br /> Sucking up heat to make herself stronger does not strike me as a very versatile ability. I'd recommend focusing on abilities that can solve a variety of problems... that's probably particularly important in a novel. <br /> I like that she has limited time out of her body. That should make the action more urgent. Who’s your target audience? I think Spook could work as a name, but I suspect it might have issues appealing to readers older than (say) 13. If your audience is older than that, I’d recommend something a bit more serious. Or spooky! :) If your target audience is younger, then I think Spook is fine.

How many more powers are there? I’d recommend keeping the amount limited… that will help you cut down on how much time you need to explain them. It’ll also help the readers remember them.

Sucking up heat to make herself stronger does not strike me as a very versatile ability. I’d recommend focusing on abilities that can solve a variety of problems… that’s probably particularly important in a novel.

I like that she has limited time out of her body. That should make the action more urgent.

]]> By: Tom http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-36426 Tom Mon, 20 Jul 2009 15:42:04 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-36426 I think that's definitely distinct from Danny Phantom, who suffers greatly from getting <a href="http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/NewPowersAsThePlotDemands" rel="nofollow">new powers as the plot demands</a>. DP also doesn't behave like a conventional ghost, just a person with ghost-like powers, and his 'ghost zone' is more like a parallel dimension than an afterlife. I get the impression your ghost is more like a ghost from Supernatural than Danny Phantom. I also like how she absorbs heat, which is a neat explanation for why it's cold around ghosts. Not too keen on the name. 'Spook' doesn't sound very dramatic. Finally, 'Near-sighted Jedi' is pretty funny. I think that’s definitely distinct from Danny Phantom, who suffers greatly from getting new powers as the plot demands. DP also doesn’t behave like a conventional ghost, just a person with ghost-like powers, and his ‘ghost zone’ is more like a parallel dimension than an afterlife. I get the impression your ghost is more like a ghost from Supernatural than Danny Phantom.

I also like how she absorbs heat, which is a neat explanation for why it’s cold around ghosts.

Not too keen on the name. ‘Spook’ doesn’t sound very dramatic.

Finally, ‘Near-sighted Jedi’ is pretty funny.

]]> By: Near-sighted Jedi http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-36423 Near-sighted Jedi Mon, 20 Jul 2009 15:26:56 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-36423 I'm working on a novel too, but my heroine, Spook, has ghost powers. I made them different than Danny Phantom and gave her several weaknesses, but I really hope no one thinks I'm ripping off of DP: 1) She has to leave her body as a spirit to use the majority of her powers. Since her body is still living, she can only stay out of it for a limited amount of time. 2) Since I don't want her to be invulnerable, Spook can be hurt in spirit form. She has to will herself to become intangible, so bad guys can hurt her too. Pain from injuries transfers to her physical body, so if she gets wounded enough, it can kill her. If Spook's body dies, so does she. 3) If she enters a haunted place, angry spirits and entities can harm her more easily than they could if she were in her mortal shell. She can also be exorcised, preventing her from entering a place again. I'm not sure whether she should be able to possess people or not. 4) Spook can draw heat and energy from the environment and people to strengthen herself, but too much can cause lights to flicker or go out. Sapping too much from a person can give them hypothermia or make them hit the floor, limp as a ragdoll. That's not everything, but what do you think? I would greatly appreciate the advice of experts. By the way, Superhero Nation is pretty damn funny. Good work. I’m working on a novel too, but my heroine, Spook, has ghost powers. I made them different than Danny Phantom and gave her several weaknesses, but I really hope no one thinks I’m ripping off of DP:

1) She has to leave her body as a spirit to use the majority of her powers. Since her body is still living, she can only stay out of it for a limited amount of time.

2) Since I don’t want her to be invulnerable, Spook can be hurt in spirit form. She has to will herself to become intangible, so bad guys can hurt her too. Pain from injuries transfers to her physical body, so if she gets wounded enough, it can kill her. If Spook’s body dies, so does she.

3) If she enters a haunted place, angry spirits and entities can harm her more easily than they could if she were in her mortal shell. She can also be exorcised, preventing her from entering a place again. I’m not sure whether she should be able to possess people or not.

4) Spook can draw heat and energy from the environment and people to strengthen herself, but too much can cause lights to flicker or go out. Sapping too much from a person can give them hypothermia or make them hit the floor, limp as a ragdoll.

That’s not everything, but what do you think? I would greatly appreciate the advice of experts. By the way, Superhero Nation is pretty damn funny. Good work.

]]> By: Marissa http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-36253 Marissa Sat, 18 Jul 2009 22:08:06 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-36253 Hey, KitKat! I don't think I've seen you around before, so welcome to Superhero Nation. <br /> For the appearance issue: There are plenty of ways aside from looking in the mirror. Looking in the mirror says, 'This is what they look like.' Readers don't care what they look like enough to hold up the action to find out, so you have to insert it in a way that doesn't hold up the action. Make it a part of something more important. For example, if a character has to go undercover, but they have bright blonde hair, that might stand out. In that case, they'd give a thought to their hair color, in the 'maybe I should disguise it' context. As an example from my own story, one character claims that he knows another character better than she knows herself. Her response is, to prove that his claim is wildly inaccurate, the simple, "What color are my eyes?" This is proving a point first and foremost, but it adds in the little eye color detail as a side note. <br /> And for the eating scene: Yeah, you're correct there. As long as something is going on aside from eating, you're fine. This means that no more than one or two sentences should go toward describing the food, and the rest of the scene should be the important actions or conversations going on during the meal. Hey, KitKat! I don’t think I’ve seen you around before, so welcome to Superhero Nation.

For the appearance issue: There are plenty of ways aside from looking in the mirror. Looking in the mirror says, ‘This is what they look like.’ Readers don’t care what they look like enough to hold up the action to find out, so you have to insert it in a way that doesn’t hold up the action. Make it a part of something more important. For example, if a character has to go undercover, but they have bright blonde hair, that might stand out. In that case, they’d give a thought to their hair color, in the ‘maybe I should disguise it’ context.

As an example from my own story, one character claims that he knows another character better than she knows herself. Her response is, to prove that his claim is wildly inaccurate, the simple, “What color are my eyes?” This is proving a point first and foremost, but it adds in the little eye color detail as a side note.

And for the eating scene: Yeah, you’re correct there. As long as something is going on aside from eating, you’re fine. This means that no more than one or two sentences should go toward describing the food, and the rest of the scene should be the important actions or conversations going on during the meal.

]]> By: KitKat http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-36252 KitKat Sat, 18 Jul 2009 21:47:21 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-36252 im writing a novel that has characters with powers in it. one way that i was getting information (that you would get from 3rd person) is because the narator is a girl with telepaty so she can hear the thougts of other people. I tend to only share the specific thoughts she hears that are important to the story or that particular scene/event. Also i was trying to figure out how to describe the look of Jacqueline (my main character) but was having trouble figuring out how... i know what she looks like and everything obviously but without using the mirror thing i couldn't come up with a good way to even mention how she looks imperticular or as easily as the other characters. (she has long, wavy dirty blode hair, somewhat pale skin, and blue-ish green eyes if that helps). Also, if there is a scene where characters are eating would it be ok as long as there is an important conversation or issue that comes up in it? For example, think of a cafetiria where there are things going on and conversations going on and it's not really focused on the food. im writing a novel that has characters with powers in it. one way that i was getting information (that you would get from 3rd person) is because the narator is a girl with telepaty so she can hear the thougts of other people. I tend to only share the specific thoughts she hears that are important to the story or that particular scene/event. Also i was trying to figure out how to describe the look of Jacqueline (my main character) but was having trouble figuring out how… i know what she looks like and everything obviously but without using the mirror thing i couldn’t come up with a good way to even mention how she looks imperticular or as easily as the other characters. (she has long, wavy dirty blode hair, somewhat pale skin, and blue-ish green eyes if that helps).

Also, if there is a scene where characters are eating would it be ok as long as there is an important conversation or issue that comes up in it? For example, think of a cafetiria where there are things going on and conversations going on and it’s not really focused on the food.

]]> By: Tom http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-29165 Tom Fri, 22 May 2009 21:40:06 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-29165 Dory... SpongeBob... Patrick? Do I even want to know? Dory… SpongeBob… Patrick? Do I even want to know?

]]> By: Banana Slug http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-29125 Banana Slug Fri, 22 May 2009 14:30:36 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-29125 "<b>3. Please don’t switch point-of-view midchapter.</b>" I recently reviewed my best friend's first fan fic. It started off with all the characters singing. I can't remember what they were singing, but it was basically written like this: <br /> <i>"X!" sang Dory. "Y!" sang SpongeBob. "Z...uh...I can't remember the words." sang Patrick.</i> <br /> They were all in separate houses. “3. Please don’t switch point-of-view midchapter.”
I recently reviewed my best friend’s first fan fic. It started off with all the characters singing. I can’t remember what they were singing, but it was basically written like this:

“X!” sang Dory. “Y!” sang SpongeBob. “Z…uh…I can’t remember the words.” sang Patrick.

They were all in separate houses.

]]> By: B. Mac http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-23327 B. Mac Fri, 10 Apr 2009 00:36:43 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-23327 Here are a few reasons that I think it works pretty well for the Animorphs. <br /> 1. There are two strong restrictions on the morphing powers: secrecy and time-limit. So it's well-established that the characters can't use it whenever they like, however much they like. These restrictions are easy for readers to understand, which makes them strong and dramatic obstacles for the characters. <br /> 2. Additionally, the characters can only morph into animals that they've "acquired" by touch. This reduces the potential for characters to pull a solution out of their ass. However, it <i>does</i> give the characters a chance to prepare for a situation by acquiring an appropriate animal. The character's preparation can be very interesting and can help set up the main plot well. <br /> 3. Since morphing is the only special power in the series, it's easy for the readers and author to keep track of what the characters can do. I don't think it works as well when it's part of an ensemble. <br /> 4. The books bend over backwards to show that the animal forms affect the personalities and mindsets of the characters, when they are in those bodies. Usually, when a fantasy character can turn into a dragon or something like that, the author doesn't use any personality change. It makes the transformer more of a Mary Sue. It also makes the transformation feel more like flicking a switch. "I think I'll be a dragon today!" See my comment about Jake Long above for an example of why Jake Long handled this much better. <br /> 5. At the end of the two-hour limit, the character is stuck in his animal body forever. That adds the prospect of danger, especially after the author took the unusual step of actually turning one of the characters into a full-time hawk. <br /> In contrast, here are a few warning signs that suggest a shapeshifting character is not that interesting. For example, I find Beast Boy's powers a bit dull. --He can shift into any animal he wants. --He can use his powers in public, wherever and whenever he wants. --There is no time limit or any other limit on his powers. --The change is purely physical; it doesn't affect his personality or anything like that. Here are a few reasons that I think it works pretty well for the Animorphs.

1. There are two strong restrictions on the morphing powers: secrecy and time-limit. So it’s well-established that the characters can’t use it whenever they like, however much they like. These restrictions are easy for readers to understand, which makes them strong and dramatic obstacles for the characters.

2. Additionally, the characters can only morph into animals that they’ve “acquired” by touch. This reduces the potential for characters to pull a solution out of their ass. However, it does give the characters a chance to prepare for a situation by acquiring an appropriate animal. The character’s preparation can be very interesting and can help set up the main plot well.

3. Since morphing is the only special power in the series, it’s easy for the readers and author to keep track of what the characters can do. I don’t think it works as well when it’s part of an ensemble.

4. The books bend over backwards to show that the animal forms affect the personalities and mindsets of the characters, when they are in those bodies. Usually, when a fantasy character can turn into a dragon or something like that, the author doesn’t use any personality change. It makes the transformer more of a Mary Sue. It also makes the transformation feel more like flicking a switch. “I think I’ll be a dragon today!” See my comment about Jake Long above for an example of why Jake Long handled this much better.

5. At the end of the two-hour limit, the character is stuck in his animal body forever. That adds the prospect of danger, especially after the author took the unusual step of actually turning one of the characters into a full-time hawk.

In contrast, here are a few warning signs that suggest a shapeshifting character is not that interesting. For example, I find Beast Boy’s powers a bit dull.
–He can shift into any animal he wants.
–He can use his powers in public, wherever and whenever he wants.
–There is no time limit or any other limit on his powers.
–The change is purely physical; it doesn’t affect his personality or anything like that.

]]> By: ikarus619x http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-23296 ikarus619x Thu, 09 Apr 2009 20:00:32 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-23296 What about the Animorphs? They change species a lot, and it works well. What about the Animorphs? They change species a lot, and it works well.

]]> By: B. Mac http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-11969 B. Mac Thu, 20 Nov 2008 09:26:44 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-11969 I think your approach to #1 is pretty good. I appreciate that your sentence does more than tell us that the character's eyes are brown. <br /> You approach to #2 sounds workable as well. <br /> I'm slightly concerned about the concept of mixing first-person narration and third-person narration in a single novel. There's probably a good reason from your perspective (something like making sure that the reader gets relevant information that the main character doesn't have access to, I bet), but I'm not sure if the readers will get the change. I don't think I've ever seen a book try it before. <br /> Oh God, no, is just what I thought for #4... <br /> #5 is kind of niche. Originally I had a longer explanation there, but I figured that it just doesn't matter to enough readers to warrant that space. I think your approach to #1 is pretty good. I appreciate that your sentence does more than tell us that the character’s eyes are brown.

You approach to #2 sounds workable as well.

I’m slightly concerned about the concept of mixing first-person narration and third-person narration in a single novel. There’s probably a good reason from your perspective (something like making sure that the reader gets relevant information that the main character doesn’t have access to, I bet), but I’m not sure if the readers will get the change. I don’t think I’ve ever seen a book try it before.

Oh God, no, is just what I thought for #4…

#5 is kind of niche. Originally I had a longer explanation there, but I figured that it just doesn’t matter to enough readers to warrant that space.

]]> By: The ReTARDISed Whovian http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-11959 The ReTARDISed Whovian Thu, 20 Nov 2008 07:41:49 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-11959 1. I only mention the appearance of my characters passively. Like: "My mum brushed some of my fringe out of my eyes" shows that the character has a relatively long fringe. Or: "Her brown eyes were lit up with happiness", because it adds more detail to the sentence. 2. I have a few scenes where the characters are eating, but it's more about the conversation than the food. 3. I always change chapters when changing from first to third person. 4. Oh, God, please no. 5. Doesn't apply. 1. I only mention the appearance of my characters passively. Like: “My mum brushed some of my fringe out of my eyes” shows that the character has a relatively long fringe. Or: “Her brown eyes were lit up with happiness”, because it adds more detail to the sentence.

2. I have a few scenes where the characters are eating, but it’s more about the conversation than the food.

3. I always change chapters when changing from first to third person.

4. Oh, God, please no.

5. Doesn’t apply.

]]> By: B. Mac http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-3628 B. Mac Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:24:17 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-3628 Hmm, that's a good point. For readers that aren't familiar with the show American Dragon, the main character and a few extras are humans that have the ability to transform into dragons. I'm inclined to excuse the show's part-time dragons because the show places a limitation on Jake's ability to transform (they can't be seen by bystanders*). Also, the show bends over backwards to demonstrate that being a dragon is as much a liability as an asset for Jake. <br /> A major problem with part-time dragons in the average fantasy story is that having two species is never actually a liability, because the PTD is free to switch between the two depending on which is convenient. That may feel inauthentic, because readers might expect that something as important as, uhh, your species is something that you wouldn't just swap out of because the other species is more useful in a given instance. I can't imagine that the dragon's attachment to being a dragon would be so casual that he'd give up being dragon (even temporarily) because it's more convenient. At the risk of drawing a totally insipid and stupid analogy, no black would put on white-face so that he fits in better at a golf tournament, and I think a dragon would be at <em>least</em> as attached to his species as a human is to his race. It generally feels inauthentic, I think, when a PTD changes for convenience's sake. For example, if a PTD changes to human form to attend a dinner because the hosts either don't like dragons or because it would be difficult to serve a dragon guest, I think it would probably be more authentic for the dragon to demand to be accommodated as he is, whether or not he has the ability to transform himself into a human. <br /> *Notwithstanding that every potential witness is a flaming idiot and can be convinced that, say, dragons doing battle with genies are part of a middle school talent show. Hmm, that’s a good point. For readers that aren’t familiar with the show American Dragon, the main character and a few extras are humans that have the ability to transform into dragons. I’m inclined to excuse the show’s part-time dragons because the show places a limitation on Jake’s ability to transform (they can’t be seen by bystanders*). Also, the show bends over backwards to demonstrate that being a dragon is as much a liability as an asset for Jake.

A major problem with part-time dragons in the average fantasy story is that having two species is never actually a liability, because the PTD is free to switch between the two depending on which is convenient. That may feel inauthentic, because readers might expect that something as important as, uhh, your species is something that you wouldn’t just swap out of because the other species is more useful in a given instance. I can’t imagine that the dragon’s attachment to being a dragon would be so casual that he’d give up being dragon (even temporarily) because it’s more convenient. At the risk of drawing a totally insipid and stupid analogy, no black would put on white-face so that he fits in better at a golf tournament, and I think a dragon would be at least as attached to his species as a human is to his race. It generally feels inauthentic, I think, when a PTD changes for convenience’s sake. For example, if a PTD changes to human form to attend a dinner because the hosts either don’t like dragons or because it would be difficult to serve a dragon guest, I think it would probably be more authentic for the dragon to demand to be accommodated as he is, whether or not he has the ability to transform himself into a human.


*Notwithstanding that every potential witness is a flaming idiot and can be convinced that, say, dragons doing battle with genies are part of a middle school talent show.

]]> By: Jim http://www.superheronation.com/2008/06/25/five-things-to-avoid-in-fantasynovels/#comment-3626 Jim Tue, 01 Jul 2008 14:06:07 +0000 http://www.superheronation.com/?p=850#comment-3626 What about the American Dragon? He switches between a dragon and human. What about the American Dragon? He switches between a dragon and human.

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